Is AMS2 too easy?

I love AMS2 so much, especially because it gives me the most immersion and best performance in VR compared to any other sim out there.
My only complaint is that driving seems a bit „too easy“ even with driving aids off which let’s me think about physics and realism…

Example: I just watched a documentary about Nürburgring Nordschleife where many real life racing drivers confirmed that it’s one of the most difficult tracks on this planet. Every corner is a challenge, you need to know every stone and drive extremely carefully and need fast reactions. A wrong driving behaviour, a bit too much throttle at the wrong place and you will certainly fly off the track and crash.

And then, apart from the professional drivers, there are the „Touristenfahrten“ where you can find thousands of YouTube videos where amateurs and semi professionals with different cars and setups show that it’s true what the pro-drivers said. They crash, and crash and crash. And of course they try their best to NOT crash, because they don’t want to destroy their own cars, lose a lot of money or risk their health and life, but still they crash or spin…

And then I drive the Nordschleife in AMS2. I enjoy it, I get good speed sensation in VR, but I don’t crash! It doesn’t even feel very difficult. I don’t have to try a corner many times to get through without spinning or crashing, I just floor the pedal, step on the brake when the corner comes close, turn in, floor the throttle again. I have super grip and always feel save.

I remember playing Nordschleife in AC where I had to lift at Schwedenkreuz, but in AMS2 I just go full throttle.

What‘s your experience with this track and different cars there? Do you have serious problems to keep the car on track?

I also posted in another thread that I have problems in AMS2 to get my wheels spinning to make burnouts and donuts, so this could also contribute to my above „problem“. I believe that the physics in AMS2 are correctly simulated and the problem is on my side. But what can you suggest me to get more difficulty and to feel the „fear“ of spinning/crashing on Nordschleife?

 

Yes I feel it's easier to drive than other sims.

 

"If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough." --Mario Andretti

Idk what car you are talking about here, but since most such observations are based on GT3/GTE cars I will assume we are talking about those.

Is AMS2 easy far below the limit? Yes. But it should be. If you drive a prepared race car and don't push the limits of the traction circle, it should be very easy to keep the car on the track. Sims where you can spin a car far below the limit just by putting in "wrong inputs" or touching a kerb are just artificially increasing the difficulty to make a videogame seem more "realistic". Those YT videos create a bias because a) they are not prepared race cars and are driven by people who don't know what they're doing, and b) they don't show the thousands of drivers who didn't crash.

The real question is: Is AMS2 easy at or above the limit? Maybe, I don't know. I'm certainly not good enough at the Nordschleife to stay consistently at the limit for the entire lap. Maybe you can easily insert yourself at the top of the TT leaderboards in whatever car it is you're talking about.

This comparison makes no sense because: a) it doesn't state which car was used, b) what wing settings were used, or c) whether you actually entered the corner fast enough to even be at the limit. Also, being able to take Schwedenkreuz by lifting sounds entirely wrong. The corner is famous for brutal lift-off oversteer. If you make the mistake of lifting mid-corner, the proper response should be to fly off the track and crash into the barriers at 150 kph, as witnessed in many expensive YT videos. Thus the way to take it (if you can't make without lifting) is to slow down a bit before you enter the corner and then to get back on the throttle while cornering.

 

Well….as everything in life, it’s complicated. I do 90% of all sim driving on the Nordschleife and I know the track very well. It seems to be easier with some cars while others can be a handful. As example, GTE class is pretty easy to drive while the Stock Car 2021 is more challenging. The Schwedenkreuz can be taken full with GT3 but not GT4 (as example). I actually lost more cars at the Schwedenkreuz than anywhere else on the track.
The Touristenfahrten crashes happen for several reasons. If you drive the Nordschleife in real life, you loose the perception of speed. You always feel like driving slower than you actually do. So, people enter corners to fast and get in trouble. Another reason is that often people have no track knowledge and with that get in trouble at the blind corners or corners in general. For me, the Nordschleife is the most challenging track and that is why I love it ;-)

 

Try to get to the top of the Nordschleife leaderboards and see if it is still as easy to drive fast as you think it is.
You are right that there are lots of videos of crashes at the Nordschleife. That's because it would be boring to post videos of the >99% of laps where there are no crashes.

 

It is heavily car dependent. But I remember my 1st steps on AMS2 last year in june or july,, not sure. I was even unable to make a straight start with a modern car. I couldn't keep the car straight for a time and refunded it..
After a month I gave it a 2nd chance. And it became my favorite sim (most of the time) since then.. Currently maybe it is my driving improved, supported with physics updates, but; having no issues now..

"Easy" is very generic word and AMS2 is as well; considering hundreds of contents, thousands of combinations...

 

Also driving quite a bit at the Nords. Driving a GT3 or GT4 fast is relatively easy. However if you push them to the limit, you will likely crash. The gap between "fast" and "the limit" is huge with these cars.
However, I've always wondered if the physics are a bit lenient allowing to push hard in unrealistic ways, somewhat abusing the car and track (notably, kerbs). No answer to that as I never drove in real life on the Nords at the limit, but when I see a top driver that does in this awesome video below, I think the sim is not too far off in term of pushing hard:

 

Like others said, depends mostly on a car. GT3 looks like they are currently broken if you disable TC. I know, GT3 should have high grip but without TC it should probably (according to other games) work differently. Maybe some kind of stabilization is there too. Many other cars are completely fine.

Or we have same problem on our ends

edit:
And my experience is cars without any electronics works great. Try some 60s formulas.

 

These are the laptimes for the GT3 class for the VLN Langstreckenrennen:
Training - 62. EIBACH ADAC ACAS Cup (NEU)
Rennen - 62. EIBACH ADAC ACAS Cup

The AMS2 leaderboards are somewhere around those times. If you can match that easily, you're probably right Else, you're probably way below the limit.

 

I fully agree with that.
And without wanting to sound (too much ) like an elitist prick my answer to the question above this thread is that if I did hear an assessment that AMS2 is too easy from guys topping the LB lists I would listen pretty serious.
But when I hear it from guys whose names I have never seen on any LB list then I take it pretty relaxed.
Because such an assesment of AMS2 is only qualified if it is launched by someone who is able to keep the cars in this sim consistently close to the edge of loosing tire tarmac adhesion.
Yes I said it.

ByTheWay: Conserning comparasment of RL driving then I was driving FF1600 formula cars when I was young. Lots of years ago.
But I can still remember the day/night experience of these cars when cruising around a track at about 95% of the speed I was able to - and then when going 100-101% in a fight for a position on the grid.
Such racing cars are extremely stable and easy to handle when you dont try to (or is not able to) "push the envelope" of the cars capabilities.
By-ByTheWay: Its easy to find my name on some of the LB lists in AMS2

 

A further complication is how does one balance the 'difficulty' in relation to the ai if you are in single player. I refer in parenthesis because Im not talking about the difficulty slider but rather the ability to regain control once adhesion is lost. Some cars irl snap horribly the other way once a correction is made, some continue the spin no matter what one does etc etc. Obviously the ai with their algorithms are better at this than 99% of people (otherwise loads more of us would be racing drivers). The conundrum becomes a balancing act between having an experience which emulates racing cars on the edge, against being so on the edge all the time in order to keep up and compete with the ai at your chosen difficulty that the slightest mistake means race is effectively over, because as we all know, the chances of the ai making an unforced error are effectively zero.
So having it slightly easier than real life to regain control in order to continue to compete seems like a good trade off, unless you make the ai less competitive but once you start pushing any mistake becomes catastrophic.
How many people would continue to play a sim that really did show just how crap they really were... elephant in the room perhaps.
Just some musings on a meta level that are opinion based not data driven..

 

Same, and often higher than yours

 

i think there is no such thing as easy in racing cars/games.
even with arcade physics like need for speed u will still find someone who manages to be faster than you, and figuring out how to be as quick or quicker than him wont be easy.
that being said i personally think the game feels alright and driving classes that arent made for children (gt3), like the super v8 or the prev gen stockcar u will quickly notice a decent difficulty in being quick and consistant around pretty much any track

 

Hello guys, thank you all for your answers. As I already wrote in my opening post I believe that the AMS2 physics are correct and that the problem is on my side (too slow, not on the limit,…)
I just wanted to know if/how I could experience the thrill/fear of making mistakes and flying off the track or spinning like I did in AC, especially at Nordschleife.
Okay I could play AC but I want to have this experience in AMS2!
Okay I could become an alien and #1 in the leaderboard and drive on the limit but maybe I‘m just not good enough.
So maybe a worse setup which makes the car more loose and more difficult to drive even at lower speeds?
I think that if I would sit in a real high powered car in real life and do the things I do in AMS2 I would crash or spin, especially BECAUSE I‘m a noob and NOT an alien or professional race driver.
And what I still don’t understand: How can I floor the throttle in first gear (with driving aids OFF) and NOT spin my wheels. In real life I would expect to see a lot of smoke, lose control of the car and spin and/or crash. They would say: oh my god, who allowed this idiot to try out such a super car without driving aids???
This is what I‘m missing a bit…

 

Me too!

 

My guess is TC is currently unswitchable for some cars. I play every game without TC and AMS2 was fine until new TC settings. Something is probably broken. Many people use "real" TC so it could be similar to them than before but it's not to me.

 

It's not the TC. Turning off TC will result in more wheel spin as expected (tested with the AMG GT3 using various combinations of TC level and assist levels). You also clearly hear if the TC is on versus when it's not on.

The issue is the diff, which remains quite locked at low speeds and acts as a form of "invisible traction control". Reducing the preload will give you more tyre fire but still not quite enough to insta-bin the car like in most other sims.

 

I don't know what it is but if I disable ABS and TC and can floor brake or gas without any problems, something is probably not right. Don't know what it is but I am not alone.

Some cars are too stable like with some stability control. Is it the diff too?

 

No clue what you mean. Which cars?

 

Famous Mclaren?