Does anybody still like the F-Extreme?

Cause I'm trying to not hate it but I honestly feel like something's a bit wonky. I know that its always been a monster that'll eat the faint alive but still I was putting in a few thousand miles with it in the months before AMS launched and I came to grips with it. It started to make sense.

With AMS now... I'm trying but its not connecting. It comes down to whats happening at the limit of grip and I'm not sure if its with the suspension or the tires but it feels slidey and snappy. The car feels like it wants to yaw pretty badly and its pretty easy to unsettle it. I tried reverting to the SCE default set up because I found that the AMS default is very different, apparently much stiffer? I seem to have found it a bit more drivable and a bit less prone to just snapping on me but its still not behaving.

Examples of things that feel weird to me are like how the tires seem to behave in hairpins. I get a lot of inside front lock up not under braking going through tight corners. Take Montreal modern Turn 1 complex. I get the new tire squealing sounds going through there the whole time at what I consider a reasonable pace and I see smoke in my mirrors and that's while driving in a smooth and controlled manner. Never seen that before. In general I'm getting that tire squeal thing whenever I'm putting lots of lock in with high loads into the car, so basically low and medium speed corners. Turning in also feels odd compared to before, and not really like any of the other formula cars. Car feels like it wants to snap out of control far more than it wants to understeer if you put in too much lock.

The other thing is I kinda feel like braking distances have gotten worse. At 100% brake pressure I'm braking where I feel like I used to on the default 88% (now set at 85% in the new set up). Maybe mechanical grip is really down in the new physics and that's making braking worse. I've driven it at normal through max road usage.

While the classic turbo power surge that causes lots of problems for people seems exacerbated by this its not really what I feel is the problem (if there is one). Now I'm no pro driver and I'm not the most consistent and I've held off on posting this for a couple weeks now. As it stands however I'm having a hard time seeing myself driving this thing alot and in the last version of SCE I was considering full race lengths. Now even if I could manage the new car on a full race length I'm not sure I'd even want to try. Doesn't feel fun. Maybe that's realistic but somehow my gut (that most inaccurate of measurements) is telling me otherwise. At this point the FV12 feels positively tame and predictable and it used to be my white whale.

Thoughts anyone?

 

It isn't the easiest car to drive fast, especially the braking in combination with down shifting.
I have to use my clutch wisely, otherwise the back overtakes the front.
I like the squealing sound, its because of the lateral force on the tires in a corner.

 

I can only fully agree on everything, mate. But for me it's like that since forever (GSCE). I was furious when hitting tire-lock + squeal + smoke on Hockenheim's hairpin, so had to turn sound effects to 50% not to hear them squeals and take wiiiiiiiiiiider turns I personally think it's physics engine limitations or something as I met such problems on couple of occasions during my rF1 days. As you can imagine I'm now even able to say that Niels could f*ck something up while creating physics

And yeah, I still like F-Extreme very much.

 

What do you mean clutch, lol ? This car doesn't use the clutch during driving.

I went and did a couple of laps at Catalunya 1993 short layout. Apart form some curbs being a bit problematic, the car itself feels fine. Yes, it is still snappy and difficult to race (compared to FReiza or V10), but overall the traits remain the same as in SCE. Need to be patient and precise with the inputs, especially steering input/angle and amount of throttle. I'd speculate there is even more fidelity and detail to the handling/physics...

 

But, yeah, the vehicle is probably the hardest to race...For me at least.
Demands advanced ambition and concentration, fast reflexes and very accurate inputs.

 

Quote "What do you mean clutch, lol ? This car doesn't use the clutch during driving."

The car uses the clutch as part of the transmission.
I use the clutch to safe my ride, if i don't use it my engine stalls when i come to a standstill.
You can also use the clutch for dosing the motorbreak, sometimes you can safe the car from spinning by engaging the clutch.

 

Eh, I figured people would do this, presume I just need to learn to drive better. I got pretty good at driving the old iteration at the limit. It feels totally different now right at the edge. It feels better in some ways I think inside the limits of grip than before but at the limit the behavior is just not quite the same in my arbitrary feels.

For instance the locking of the wheels and the tire smoke in Montreal Turn 1/2 is just something I know is different and I know didn't happen before. I mean, since when does any car give you tire smoke at 70mph well under the limits of grip while not sliding?

That could very well be what has changed things and I sense that has improved a considerable amount of the feel. I like the feel a lot better for 95% of the regime of this car now, its just at the limit I'm stymied because it feels less predictable and way too easy to unsettle. Otherwise the FFB is better than ever before.

In general every car feels 100% better now except for the Extreme (which feels mostly better). Dunno, maybe its just gonna get better when they do the KERS/Turbo update (I presume that's happening in some way given their roadmap).

I dunno, I think it might be the tires. They definitely changed something enough for them to make a substantially different default set up.

 

It's the most challenging car in the sim.I enjoy driving it,but it takes an age to master it.I don't have the time to spend racing to master it,so sadly it gets pushed to the sidelines.It's super snappy which mirrors it's real life counter part.IMO if I go open wheel,then the Retro's and the vee's can't be beaten for enjoyment.They are challenging, but can be caught.

 

It feels fine to me (relative to the other cars). Don't try rF2 if you think this car is skittish--even the lowest powered cars there will spin around like this one.

I think what will help anyone struggling with this car is to remember the MASSIVE low-end torque these things produce. The total opposite of prior F1 cars for decades that had to be revved to the max to exploit the engine. You do not want to rev this thing beyond around the middle zone on the rpm bar on the steering wheel unless it's on a major straightaway that you can floor it. For corners, there is way more than enough torque to hold your line at medium engine speeds. You want lower engine speeds to prevent the slightest twitch of your right foot from inducing a spin in the corner

 

Yes Rfactor2 is very skittish,but in a different way.My problem in the extremes is under braking,not coming out of the corners,I can control the throttles fine.It spins under braking very easy for me.My break balance is forward as well.I'm crap with set up so any advice is welcome.

 

Yea that's my experience as well. In AMS I've had interesting experiences with the tail actually fishing left and right under braking on the straight and even with a forward bias its very rear happy. That's nothing to do with the turbos.

I actually feel like the old SCE default set up is better, for me anyway.

 

Default setup is sooo front heavy springwise, that it leads to all sort of problems.

 

I noticed that the bump rubbers are something like twice as stiff as the old default.

 

I have the same "problem" as you, the car spins under braking. I managed to put forward brake balance, a lot of it, increased rear aero and softened the rear a bit. Snap oversteer under braking is under more control now, but as you described before, on the limit the car is very difficult to control under heavy braking. Forget about minimal tail braking on this car.

I need setup advise too

 

Attached is a quick setup I made where suspension (apart from the 3rd springs) is tuned according to modern principles; stiffer springs at the back. Dampers have been adjusted accordingly. One cannot dive as deep into corners as with a more traditional, stiff-front setup, but more speed is gained in and out of corners (mid & exit).

I didn't touch aero nor diff lock, and yet it is more stable for a mediocre driver like me (at Interlagos). Naturally you still have to be careful with the throttle. Enjoy or disregard.

 

I'll give it a shot!

 

I thought the same thing last nite driving this. I did struggle but as just came off the back of playing f12015 free weekend, I presumed it was the physics jump.

I did find I had to lower brake pressure to 80 did help but I think if u persevere with the car it will come to you. Let's face it Niels hasn't done a bad car yet!

dan

 

Cheers Chief.

 

I agree,Niels is the man.My driving talent cannot match his feel for physics ha.

 

Just remember we're still early access here. And when we talked about how the MetalMoro didn't feel right they agreed and changed it so never hurts to voice your thoughts, even though I bet against myself in the long run with Niels too.