What do you think is the most significant reason AMS2 userbase is so small?

Late to the party on this but wanted to share my thoughts. All comes down to one thing in my opinion (assuming a functional base game which we have now): What compels the player to play the game?

My take on this is brutal, probably controversial, but simply that the online experience is lacking compared to other sims. By focusing as much on the single player side of the game, it is shutting itself off from where the sim racing market is already at.

As an online league admin AMS2 is my favorite because it has so many crucial small features which make the experience feel authentic, from climatic conditions to real fuel limits and so on. I can deliver my users a robust 3D experience very easily. People seem to like detailed experiences like this but understandably don’t want to spend the time creating them for themselves, only to be limited to racing robots. Online racing adds something that AI will never be able to reproduce. That being said:

1. Server stability. The game net code handles global drivers relatively well but the P2P nature of the in game lobby can inherently cause issues where players desync and aren’t scored/timed correctly. I’ve seen this occur lots of times running an online league. Only need to not be timed correctly (sometimes people drop a lap weirdly or don’t get scored at all) once and someone will be put off investing their time, fearful it will be in vain. This also affects the ranked system as is known.
2. Lack of an effective dedi server system. Whilst the in game servers are easy to put up for pick up races, the only dedi tool available for AMS2 is a ported homebrew PC2 one which is offers no real options to a league admin beyond a way to automatically limit grids to 22 and under as it kicks drivers above that level. For leagues to seriously use the game we need a stable tool which the capability to hold as large a grid as possible. A dedi enables a server log file to be produced which enables leagues to create championships easier, which in turn makes it more compelling for the online racer. Beyond this, the ability to manually bop classes (restrict power %, add kg) further enables the admin to create various compelling scenarios for their drivers which directly drives game usage. The sky is the limit here and the more tools (such as race type options etc) that are available really opens up the game to the creative admin to craft compelling racing and boom, you’re talking 25+ returning users per league.
3. Scheduled ranked races. Much has been said about this and it speaks for itself. Leagues can be intimidating to join, so a centralized system of races can be an effective way of birthing users into the online part of the game. It’s basically what is keeping R3E on life support, serving as proof that people like scheduled events where they don’t have to spend time thinking about what to race and how to setup the race. I would caution though that this is best applied with thought to keeping the grid clean, which is where iRacing and R3E fail. I like how leagues can hosted ranked servers in AMS2 and feel we as leagues can contribute a lot to the community this way as we can police our grids, creating a easy way for drivers to find grids and communities without a large input of resource creating a cumbersome ranked structure.

I appreciate that I only represent a small part of the community but I feel that every improvement on the online experience to AMS2 directly helps it and provides longevity. You still see AMS1 being used in leagues so I think that proves my point that a solid and well thought out online experience really extends the life to the game.

There’s so much to like about the core driving and racing experience in AMS2 that once the final polish elements come, then it really will take off. I don’t see why AMS2 can’t overtake R3E and rF2 in the near future. I’d say already it’s overtaken R3E outside the EU (North America, Australia/NZ etc).

 

Wholeheartedly agreed.

Unfortunately I don't expect these features coming in the short or even mid term, and when they finally arrive the boat will have already sailed away.

 

Where will the boat have sailed though? There isn't really much out there, the sim world is pretty small and if you're not into iRacing or ACC your choices are very limited.

However, I agree that the multiplayer features discussed above are critical to making 2022 successful. Same for AI in single player. Once those get attention the player count will start to grow steadily. But It has been holding strong at ~500+ for a really long time now, so I'd say that's positive.

The tire bug seems to have had some long-term fallout that is still being worked on and Reiza is probably also in the process of updating the older content with the latest and greatest physics changes. These are all things that will get AMS2 positive attention but if new players run into MP issues or AI issues in SP they won't stick around and the numbers will stay where they are.

On the flip side...once MP and SP get some attention (and we get some QoL changes) the numbers will start to rapidly increase. To grow this community we need continuous incremental improvements and reasons to stick around (hosted multiplayer, time trial of the week, single player hotlap challenges and invitational races). Once that's in-place, they can expand a bit and focus on pumping out content.

They've been silent for a while now...that can only mean they are about to drop some major updates in the near future.

 

As a VR and online racer, those are also the 2 points the sim doesn't shine (anymore).
With the introduction of the latest content, there are some performance issues which I can not get rid of. Thinks worked better in the past and, at least for me, a sim should be as reliable as possible in case of performance. (rain / night have always been problematic, but now even dry + sunny weather gives me problems with some track and car combinations).

2nd point is the online experience, which simply isn't "there" yet. similiar as above, net code issues which result in strange things like cars jumping all over the place, wheel2wheel racing hard or even not possible with higher ping drivers (reliability!) and the physics doing interesting things on some contacts (even if it wasn't a contact at all) is a real issue to me.

Especially on the 2nd half of 2021 I've always tried to do some sort of organized online racing with AMS2 and enjoyed it most of the time, but I've not seen any improvement in that area. AMS2, right now, is not the sim I would choose if looking for a stable experience.

So, all of this leaves me with offline racing, which I'm also not into, especially looking at the flaws of the UI (settings it up correctly, their behaviour on track, etc.).
Comes down for me to booting it up once in a while if new content is added (which IS a big plus for this sim) and testing things in time trial, but only so often. Nothing which gets me back into this sim on a regular basis.

still, there is so much potential in this sim to keep it in my mind and looking on the forums like every day. I'm really looking forward to the day this sim gets some highly needed QoL improvements, as I wish to race it more.

 

I'm considering going back to iRacing, even though it is clearly (in my opinion, ofc) a very inferior game, however it nails one core feature that is strongly missing in AMS2: competition.

I'm not going to make the switch for now, tho. I still believe AMS2 can outplay every other sim out there, however I can't be waiting forever.

Also, its already 2022 and we still don't have all tyre compounds to F-Reiza, for example. I could list a lot of things, but these have been exhaustively reported on this forum.

Fingers crossed for the next few updates.

 

The name doesn't quite roll off the tongue. Doesn't really describe what the product is. It's not aligned with any major racing series or gaming studio.

 

Is the user base small?

Anyway, assuming it is, I suppose the main reason would be market saturation and the niche-within-a-niche syndrome already mentioned in the thread.

Secondly, I'd guess there could be some bad vibes associated with the SMS engine among the 'serious sim racing crowd'. The PC3 and PC GO credibility suicide certainly didn't help.

Finally, I think AMS2 had a rough start from the word go. I was one of those who got a forty-eight hour refund because I simply felt the product wasn't ready for release. It's kinda tough because that's when most reviews were written.

The game has come a long way since, and maybe it just takes time to win hearts and minds and establish a title. First impressions tend to last and all that, but that said, I can't think of a similar product where you can drive a more than reasonable variety of Formula 1 cars from the mid '70s to present day on a fair selection of period correct tracks. That's actually a feat on its own, I think.

 

I think the user base is considered small due to it being behind Raceroom, RF2 and PC2. However...it's growing, slowly but surely. The 2022 F1 car is going to bring the numbers up significantly.

It currently crushes Grid:Legends though lol (sadly that franchise is probably going to be no more). With Dirt Rally being shuttered as well I wouldn't be surprised to see some former Codemasters/SMS devs create a new studio. Better yet, maybe they join Reiza so they can start bringing the fight to Kunos and Motorsport Games (don't laugh, they are making slow but steady progress in RF2 and the upcoming Indycar game is their best chance for redemption).

 

inactive social media. lack of exciting modern content. fix the 2 and the game atleast in public perception will get alot better. I still love it for the fact how easy it is to set up any kind of online event, no need to rent servers etc.

 

At least one of those is incoming with the 2022 F1 cars! Now, if it arrives strong and is well-received hopefully it will get some social media attention too.

 

From complaints observed on this forum it seems like support for hybrid control, multiple tire compounds and hiding the halo are the main concerns. Let's see what they've been brewing these past few months...

Maybe the recent ICU changes were part of an overhaul to allow hybrid control? Which might then allow direct mapping of those controls plus fuel maps? Speculation of course but it's fun with AMS2.

 

So, the April dev update confirms that ERS control is incoming, which is cool! Looks like there will be another season pass for '23+ as well!

I am happy they are in a good place financially and are not being forced to change their strategy. This can only be good for all of us, as they can shift focus to the squeakiest wheel (multiplayer) while keeping up with the DLC content and QoL improvements.

 

I'm still waiting when physics will be even close to another titles. This game just doesn’t feel like you’re really driving a car. They just make more content that has no value because the physics are so bad. Fix the physics and then make new content if you want more users for this game.

 

If you think the physics are good, I would like to hear in which planet it is possible that when you do maximum brake and keep the pressure and just turn the wheel to the corner it starts to oversteering not locking the front wheels and start understeering, and in which planet it is faster to drive corners by drifting, not on the grip?

 

On a planet where the brake bias is sufficiently far rearward.

Which car is this? It might need a tyre model revision.

 

In fact, the soapy feel of the sliding tyres in ASM 2 often reminds me of Forza Horizon 5. And a lot of the cars still seeem to have defective dampers. mainly in the rebound part. The sliding around part of cornering in AMS2 is much to safe and predictable.

 

Porsche 911 RSR -74. Yeah I think that tire model is biggest problem why that car handle like that.

 

Yeah driving with sliding is pretty easy in this game. Biggest thing to me this game feels not realistic is when I try to drive without sliding near to the limit of the grip like in other sims I am so slow, but when I overdrive the car I am so much faster. I think it’s mostly due to the tire model.

 

What makes you think you are "near to the limit of the grip" then?

 

That when I am close the to that point when car start sliding