AMS 2 damage model

I believe damage on a sim a a very important factor, it adds realism, immersion as well as punish you for your mistakes.

Of course I understand that BeamNG damage is a big nono specially in tittles that feature licensed cars such as AMS 2 but I do believe that there should be a bare minimum of damage, and fortunately several cars in AMS 2 does have a decent damage model

the thing is that just like Pcars 2 the damage model varies a lot from car to car and the point of this thread is to try to point out how its represented in each cars

Keep in mind that some cars did receive damage updates in the past (and I'm not talking exclusively of cars that didn't had damage model, cars like the CLK GTR LM and the Mercedes 190E DTM as well as I believe the Mclaren F1 did receive that treatment)

 

I'll try to rank the damage model for each car as well and I might even include car mods in the future

and note that I'm not requesting BeamNG levels of damage, first cuz thats a lot of work, and second because I know that a lot of licensed cars execs don't like that, so I'm not requesting that the chassis should be destroyed or cars to be consumed by fire but only moderate damage that can still deliver a somewhat realistic response to most crashes apart from the extreme ones

 

Let's get started with the most popular class in Sim Racing: GT3

It currently features 5 cars, the McLaren 720s GT3, the Nissan GTR GT3, the Porsche 911 GT3r, The BMW M6 GT3 and the Mercedes AMG GT3 (non evo version)

- McLaren 720s GT3: feature arguably the best damage model in class, you can lose both front and rear bumpers, a good part of the car body can deform, lose the hood and the engine cover in the rear, as well as the rear wing and interestingly, the rear diffuser can detach separately from the bumper, which is a cool touch

- Nissan GTR GT3: the most recent addition in class, it does not feature a lot of body deformation but keep the overall standard of being able to lose bumpers, rear wing and the hood

- Porsche 911 GT3r: Kept again the standard with slight body deformation, and losing bumpers, rear wing, and hood

- BMW M6 GT3: second best damage model in class with similar body deformation to the McLaren as well as the standard damage (bumpers, rear wing and hood), the trunk can have some decent deformation but does not detach if I'm not mistaken

- Mercedes AMG GT3: the worst damage model from the whole class and arguably one of the worst damage models in the whole game, only ahead of the few cars that don't have a damage model, the body can deform and the car can lose the rear wing, that's it, you can't lose any bumper, or the hood (which is odd considering that the GT4 AMG GT can lose those), keep in mind that this might change in the future considering that it did changed for the 190E DTM and the GT1 CLK LM.

 

Next the Fuscas:
they do have above average damage model, not only you have decent body deformation abut you can damage and lose most big parts of the car, not only wing hood and bumpers like previous cars, but also the engine cover, and the fenders of the car.

 

Now the Formula USA from gen 1 to 3 (as we await the arrival of the new F-USA car soon)

All the cars can have light body deformation lose the front and rear wings as well as the nose (which i consider that should be the standard damage model for every formula car in any realistic game that feature them)

However there are 2 things to point out

First that the Gen 1 have gone beyond the standard damage, also allowing the engine cover to detach and be ripped from the car (as you can see on the pic of the first post of the thead)

Second (and that's a problem for most formula cars in game) that the front wing should have a more dynamic damage, and even on the realistic damage settings sometimes crashes that should rip it off does not do it, Pcars 2 did feature a decent front wing damage where it was more sensible than lets say a front bumper of a gt car in collisions and I believe you could lost small parts of it in medium to small contacts, in a similar way to the Codemasters F1 games

 

Group C cars: okay that’s an odd one, every car have a different damage model

Corvette GTP: have the best damage model, it can lose the hood, the rear wing and the engine cover

Porsche 962 C (standard): Can lose the hood and have some body deformation on the rear, and that’s it

Porsche 962 C Low Downforce: For some reason is can’t lose any part, I’m not sure if it’s a bug or something, there’s light body deformation though

Sauber C9: Can only lose the rear wing and very light deformation and crack on the taillights and headlights

Nissan R89C: can lose hood and rear wing

 

GTE: finally a class with a standard damage module for all vehicles

every car can lose front and rear bumper, the hood, the rear wing and have light body deformation

 

I'm back, and this time I'll focus a bit on the stock cars

we have a lot of cars from several eras and classes, let's start with the one with the most interesting damage, the 2019 Cruze Stock car:

Being ported and improved from AMS 1 2018 models (sadly missing the Peugeot), the 2019 stock car have moderate deformation and can lose the exact same parts as in AMS 1. the Hood can be damaged or be ripped off, same for the rear wing and interestingly the rear cover, but the part that really surprised me was the side skirts also being destructible, and when you lose it, it reveals the side exhaust which is a real cool touch.

 

now for the 2020-2023 models we don't have an as amazing damage model. what we got is somewhat serviceable, however there is a particular issue, that is the damage on the rear.

Both Cruze and Corolla can lose the front bumper, the hood and the rear wing, the rear of the cruze can have a very light deformation and for some reason the rear window gets scratches decals, the Corolla supposedly have some damage in the rear but its buggy, the rear taillights get transparent when the rear get damaged like if the chassis had deformed but the car body didn't its odd, and the rear bumper is indestructible on both cars which as a person that watches Brazilian stock car casually since 2005 its really odd since seeing a loose bumper or a car losing it its not uncommon in a series with moderate amount of contact. woulda been nice to see a fix to the Corolla damage and the addition of rear bumper damage, as it woulda make the whole damage model for the cars a bit more realistic.

 

I love the simulator but I notice the damage from the AI vehicles is not so real

I play maximum damage and I notice that they collide but are still in the race,
I touch an AI car and a wall and my car is destroyed

I don't know if you have noticed it and is there a way to correct it?

or only the damages apply to my car, what would be the appropriate configuration to race against the AI and feel real


thank you so much

 

The AI do suffer damage but on a much smaller scale than the player. I suspect it's deliberate to avoid something like what happened with GTR2, where the AI would become very slow as the race went by because of the damage they suffered racing each other.

However I do agree it's too lenient to the AI, specially when they lose a rear wing in an open wheel car and you see them going almost full speed.

 

The AI runs on different physics than the player in the damage and the tyres... Possibly more... As very few people have enough CPU power to have 5 AI with full player side physics in all capacities... Let alone a full grid of 30+ cars...

rF2 and other sims calculate the AI suspension, aero and torque curves at slower speeds than they do the player side... I wouldn't be at all surprised if AMS2 is no different in this regard...

But with Reiza having to deal with so many problems left over from the pCARS era of the Madness engine they have to fix a lot of things before they can really concentrate on making the AI more believable in certain areas... Damage and the tyres being a big part of that...

 

Yeah the AI damage need to be addressed, I've seen AI with quite busted cars racing like nothing happened

 

AI damage and tyre wear does need revision compared to the player. Thankfully Reiza have removed the ability to break the headlights, I remember racing in PC1 with damage on in a long race with day/night cycle. The AI could race in the dark with no headlights whereas for the player it's ******* impossible! Never used damage after that.

 

As long as you can drive lap after lap without wheels in TT mode without any chance to get it repaired in the garage - then I dont think getting a more detailed overall damage model is urgent.

ByTheWay: Never mentioned by Reiza in these 3 years life that they consider this a problem.
Wheels is that urgent in a sim?

 

It is a conspiracy theory

 

that’s whataboutism m8, one problem does not exclude the other, I believe both need to be addressed, and if damage wasn’t important then reiza would never add the advanced damage model plus updating the damage for many cars like they did to open wheelers from f-vintage to f-classic and they did a fantastic job at that

and I don’t know if you read my posts properly but I stated that most cars already have a decent to great damage model, my big issue is with the issues of some cars having minor or moderate issues like for example the Mercedes GT3 having a completely different damage model than the other gt3 or the mess at group c damage model. It’s a very small number of cars that need an update, and updating the damage model is more a work for the 3D modeling guys than the coding/bug fixes guys that could work on the invisible tires glitch/bug. So again I believe both should be addressed eventually by reiza.

 

Honestly it wasnt ment so.
I have just given up getting this obvious BUG solved.
But because its probably related to the damage model in some way I consider it more urgent to solve this urgent BUG before asking for a more advanced and detailed DM.
Afterall at least some people call AMS2 a sim

ByTheWay: Why polish the wheels on the bycycle when it has no tyres on?

 

They seem to have got it right in the simulation side of the game... I haven't seen that issue in single race, test day or multiplayer in ages...

TT is a canned experience and doesn't have all the simulation features turned on... Maybe that is the route cause of the issue not a more advanced and detailed damage model, as the more advanced model is working fine...

 

Following your logic that TT mode is a more restricted/reduced mode then its even more revealing about Reiza still isnt able to handle the Mad code - that they after 3+ years havent been able to find the cause of this BUG