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Formula-Retro drivability

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Damian Baldi, Jul 2, 2020.

  1. BrunoB

    BrunoB King of Raceroom FR-US

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    Yeah thats just the mandatory arrogant answer from any besserwisser who just because he sometimes is allowed to speak a bit with some unknown game dev prowdly announce that he knows more than anybody else.
    Pretty laughtable and embarrassing if you ask me.:p
    And when I think about it then Shadak sounds a lot more believable - mainly because he often allows himself to use his critical sense - and some logic.
    Way better and reasonable approach than just blindly defending anything comming from Reiza - because a guy think he know a lot more than common "members" :rolleyes:

    ByTheWay: I think its even possible to google "besserwisser". :D
     
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  2. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    I know better in some cases, because i test this stuff (almost) every day, go figure and if it would be that easy like you think, it would be already solved.^^ This "unknown game dev" who spent hours with me testing changes over and over again, to tackle these issues gradually more and more is the head of a company, called Reiza Studios. :whistle:

    And nowhere i'm even stating, there are no issues, even agreeing to the Lotus 79 case. But keep on ranting.^^

    Pretty embarassing, how you present yourself here. Be careful with your snootily ad-hominem commenting, regarding the context, you post leaderboards of your times to feel superior to others.

    Have a nice day.

    ByTheWay: I thought you wanted to leave the sim, because the limiter sounds were so bad and the sim not competent. :rolleyes:

    ByTheWay2: Ich weiß, was Besserwisser bedeutet. ;)
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2021
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  3. Dady Cairo

    Dady Cairo Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    ByTheWay: I think its even possible to google "besserwisser". :D

    In East Germany they say "Besserwessi" since the wall is fallen!;)

    Now google that:)

    you deserve no less:p
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2021
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  4. Stix_09

    Stix_09 New Member

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    A new AMS 2 user perspective:


    I've been watching this thread with some interest as classic and vintage cars are my bread and butter in sims (which is why I don't own ACC as I'll prob never drive those cars)

    (A little about me, for perspective)
    Only recently got AMS2 after watching and waiting for improvements I knew it needed. I''m not new to car sims in general and have a number of them, incl AMS1) but I'm a bit more of a casual than most in these forums I would guess. (I'd rate my car setup knowledge a 6/10 for sim guy, not IRL car engineer, it would be lower)

    My personal thoughts:
    The retro cars (and many other cars in AMS 2 I've tried) seem to suffer from often non optimal default setups). This is not idea for new guys and those not very familiar with tuning a car. I've driven the BT44 the most and , this car for example is not great with stock settings IMHO.
    I still prefer the RF2 driving experience for these type of cars (esp the F1 retro cars). They are just more fun to drive.


    Indirectly related thoughs (this impacts mainly car setup)
    The other main thing lacking in AMS2 is information. This is more important to ppl using AMS2 for 1st time. ie missing tool tips, or incorrect wording(or unclear that's clearly a copy and port from something else at times. Other sims that have been around longer do this better, even some of the older ones with old retro UI's have even done this better.
    For example RF2 which is known for its dated interface (its improved) does a better job of conveying info to the user and has better default car settings IMHO. AMS 2 is going to suffer player base because of this IMHO (def needs work here for 1st time buyers). I don't think it would take a lot to get this right for a professional technical writer.

    If you are not going to include a manual with your product , make the UI super clear and easy to understand what each thing means (this forum(and the net) is full of people confused on UI settings and what they specifically do in AMS2).


    My wish('s) for AMS 2:
    1)Improve the newer player experience by more tool tips (and clearer wording)
    2)Improve some of the default car setup's.
    3)Fix some of the track camera positions, most ppl want to see the car not the trees and other things blocking the view.
    4)Improvements to moving the camera around in replays. Its a huge waste of such a good looking game when u have to fight the camera to watch your car.
    4)I'd love to be able to save any replay not just a whole race, (sometimes u want to capture "that thing" and u can't), I see no reason u can't save these.
    (maybe cars should bounce off side walls, currently its like a Wiley coyote cartoon where he hits the wall and slides down it)


    In summary.
    Car setup defaults need work.
    Think about the sim from perspective of someone using a car sim for first time, try not to put new ppl off with your interface information (lack of). Car setup that will put ppl into the wall with poor default car settings.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2021
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  5. Beccobunsen

    Beccobunsen Active Member

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    i vote for alternative simplified version unique screen setting for no Mechanical Engineering graduate People.
    + oversteer -
    + front height -
    + rear height -
    + first gear rate -

    etc

    why not, whit a interactive car model

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Stix_09

    Stix_09 New Member

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    I think once you get to car setup , you need to do your own homework outside the sim. The what/how or it's too much extra work for developers for info that could be explained better outside the sim.

    What is more important is the user interface makes it easy to understand the setting you are changing (it's clearly defined, as dif sims use dif terms and units etc). And the base setup is not giving average or poor results 'out of the box'. They should just need tweaking for the different tracks and conditions.

    There are settings open to interpretation (or experimentation) trying to understand how it's being used by the game , (not just car setup settings) but what it actually specifically altering (some of the wording in AMS tool tips that do exist could be more clearly explained, (think novice, not engineer).

    Project cars 2 does this quite well where everything explains what it is and does, prob as good as any sim around (same madness engine). It's a strong point of this sim (I'm just comparing the user interface and information provided, not car physics/handling, FFB etc (even if it also has more configuration then AMS) There is a night a day difference between AMS2 and a lot of sims in the one aspect.

    I find myself frustrated with AMS 2 because it feels like an incomplete product , that's not polished to the same level of completeness (driving physics , ffb aside, good but need work still) when u compare it side by side with something like PC2 we where have the opposite issue, polished but very flat to drive and less sim like. I guess I wanted to see RF2 in a PC2 graphics engine (and UI), and it fails both aspects in current state, and its even more noticeable in the retros IMHO...

    It is still very much in development at present from DLC which cover future content well into 2022 that is clear , I consider it very much an unfinished product in its present state, It's had a lot of work done and since release 12 months go , but it still needs a lot of polish , so lets see how it looks in 2 years from now.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2021
  7. azaris

    azaris Well-Known Member

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    Can we discuss the heat conduction of the bias-ply tyres on the FRetro gen 1? These tyres start off ice cold and it seems that unless the track surface is very hot, it's almost impossible to put or maintain any temperature in these things. Mostly you peak out at 50 C, maybe 60 C if you push like a maniac. Makes the pronounced understeer even worse.

    I thought the feature of bias-ply tyres was that they overheat too quickly when overdriven? I get that the FVintage tyres were rock-hard and had grooves, but by 1974/75 they were using bias-ply slicks that should at least be able to get into working temperature.
     
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  8. Shadak

    Shadak Active Member

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    Briefly tried Retro F and some other cars in last update, very interesting how LSD suddenly feels so different once they "fixed" it.
    So yeah, I still think it was a big issue.
     
  9. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    Yeah it was one of the main issues. F-Retro needed earlier diff unlocking, aero tweaks and had some tire tweaks too. They should feel a lot better in v1.3 now.
     
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  10. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    And to give this thread a definitive update:

    Yes, F-Retro doesn't make me ragequit Long Beach or Totally Not Monaco anymore :D

    They're drivable now...and more.
     
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  11. James Lee GTE

    James Lee GTE Active Member

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    Brabham BT44 at Imola 72 is now a joy and in my opinion better overall than the RF2 combo! I’m so happy! 18 months of frustration has finally come to an end and this combo was fully worth the wait!
     
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  12. Maser V6

    Maser V6 Assume nothing. Verify everything. Have Fun Reiza Backer

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    QUOTE="James Lee GTE, post: 160418, member: 16555"]Brabham BT44 at Imola 72 is now a joy and in my opinion better overall than the RF2 combo! I’m so happy! 18 months of frustration has finally come to an end and this combo was fully worth the wait![/QUOTE]


    Well said James.
    Damned things so natural now its going to be hard to find the time to test/enjoy the other class's :D had a blast online in the 44 with 100/100 robots, they also are now v/nice with players mixed in.

    BT44 reminded me yesterday of a symphony of driver inputs and car responses, rather than Stylophone with bad contacts!


    300px-Originalstylophone.jpeg
     
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  13. GregzVR

    GregzVR Passionate VR sim racer

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    Has this car class' handling issues been fixed now? I haven't driven them in over year now, and was hoping the 1.3.0.x updates have sorted them out.
    I'm not at my PC, so I can't test for myself right now.
     
  14. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    Check the last few recent post...i would recommend trying them again, when you have time. Might feel a tad different now :whistle:
     
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  15. Maser V6

    Maser V6 Assume nothing. Verify everything. Have Fun Reiza Backer

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    [
    Go for it Gregz doubt you will be let down.
    BT44 and lotus 79 / Cosworth cars are great. Trying the fanny car later today
     
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  16. F1Aussie

    F1Aussie Well-Known Member

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    How long have you been a staff member for? Never noticed that before.
     
  17. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    I'm doing my gig for Reiza for some months already, but it's completely official now i guess. :)

    Back to topic:

    F-Retro actually turns in now!!! :eek:
     
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  18. F1Aussie

    F1Aussie Well-Known Member

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    So what is your role or you aren't allowed to say? Lol
     
  19. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Staff Member Reiza Backer

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    Under my name it basically is visible, testing stuff and providing german language to game and shopsites + checking the forums out, informing, making sure nobody spreads misinformation, looking out for you guys behaving like grown ups...usual stuff. :p

    Back to topic now please!
     
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