I tested the BOP on the GT3’s on Sunday evening before the F1 of course and again this morning. With my own set ups, around Kyalami modern, the lap times are miles out. The McLaren is just over three seconds a lap faster than the Merc. The BMW is pretty much equal to the McLaren, I think I could tune it further so it’s identical. With the Porsche I’m struggling to get within 1.5 seconds of the McLaren. But the Porsche is still around 1.5 seconds a lap quicker than the Merc. The McLaren and the BMW absolutely swallow up the Porsche and Merc on the straights, it’s almost like they are not only a different manufacturer, but a different car class entirely. The Porsche gets back 1.5 secs of three 3 secs compared to the Merc, because it brakes and corners like a beast. The braking point of the Porsche is much later than the McLaren and BMW, it turns better and you can get on the power quicker. But as soon as I hit the long straights it gets swallowed up by the McLaren and BMW with their immense straight line speed. If the Porsche was a bit quicker on the straights that would make for excellent tactical racing, with the cars having different strengths and weaknesses. The Merc however is the most stable of the four / least fun to drive and it’s a total HAAS of a car in performance. Making it almost redundant in this car class. Please show the Merc some love and make the GT3 overall BOP tighter. Thank you.
It's because of the altitude in Kyalami. But yes, we all agree the altitude-difference might a bit unbalanced, tho. I am sure Reiza will BoP it out in the future.
Ok my mind is now completely blown with the level of detail in this sim. I had to go test your answer out and I must admit I laughed out loud and had a big smile on my face when it was proven correct. I took the Merc and the McLaren out for a spin at Silverstone modern and not only was the Merc fun to drive, but also two tenths quicker than the McLaren. Honestly, I have no words. The weather, the foliage, the altitude, live track and lord knows what other crazy details and level of details they have under the bonnet in this sim, that affect the cars and how you drive them. This sim is a different gravy! Wow!
Try the McLaren at Ibarra, literally a rocket ship. I can't say whether or not the difference in performance at that altitude is accurate or not, I literally have no clue. But it is significant. Would that kind of difference in performance not be dealt with as best as possible in a RL series?
Yeah if you were doing a series you'd truly have to consider altitude in choosing tracks. The only GT3 I don't enjoy is the BMW. I can't seem to find a setup where it doesn't feel odd at some point. I do hope we get the ability to BOP cars though as I think it is too much to ask Reiza to do a per track BOP like ACC.
Turbo cars basically don't lose any engine power at altitude, because they maintain a constant supply of air. Also efficient/effective aerodynamics help in addition. So the 720S and M6 maintain more performance, than the NA Porsche and AMG. It's really significant. In real life it's managed by track related BoP categories. Right now, AMS2 doesn't have it to that degree, but there are already considerations of how to solve it, it might take a bit still, but it's not off the table.
BoP is usually given out per race by the race organizer. Technical it is mostly done with add on weight and air restrictors in the intake system. None of that is available in AMS2, and even sims that allow such measures have to use a custom setup lock. This factor is much more a reason why ASM2 is taken down for league racing, not so much the mising rating system. And when you consider the BoP in GT3 class bad, better don't look into the GT4 class.
Thanks fella's. I understand the mechanics, well in a very basic way at least. But I'm always surprised by how much is an advantage it is. But then again Ibarra is an extreme case. Anyway hopefully some way levelling out those edge cases can be found in the future.
...of an virtually unrestricted racing category, Imperio Endurance. Based on my limited understanding the only thing they do is balance weight, not horsepower as well. Knowing this, until Reiza makes weight/ballast adjustments to the cars, we as end user MP racers, have to either chose the most competitive cars, or the MP host makes it a single car race. I expect there to be grumblings that some peoples' favorite cars (porsche or merc in this case) may not be competitive in a full grid context, but there are some work arounds host should and can implement so people have some variety. I'd would totally join an all merc race lobby.
Just going to say pre-emptively that this is true in principle, but what's even cooler is that Ibarra's over 2000m altitude and thin air / lower barometric pressure can overwhelm some turbos. Unless it was changed since, the 2002's turbo can't work hard enough to produce enough airflow for peak power from thinner air. So yet another detail. Actually simulating the turbo makes it respond to different barometric pressure and cause noticeable differences in power delivery. There can be a major difference in how you need to apply and modulate throttle. There's another factor hidden in this: even if a car's turbo can produce enough boost to maintain the same peak horsepower, it will take longer to reach the turbine and compressor RPM required. So while a turbo car can produce near the same performance at high altitude, it might be very lazy and feel awful in practice. This depends on how you can adapt to it as well.
I suspect the easiest workaround for now might be to disable the altitude-dependent HP effects in multiplayer only. Sort of like "league edition" in some mods.
I tested the Merc and the McLaren at Ibarra and I’m four seconds a lap quicker in the McLaren. The Merc feels so dull and lethargic, I can’t even get it into 5th gear anywhere on the track. It’s essentially un-drivable. Conclusion, the Merc and the Porsche don’t like and don’t work at altitude! Would be kind of interesting to know at what altitude these two cars start to be adversely affected.
The basic formula for calculating naturally aspirated engine power loss is 1% per 100m. So you could say that they have 7% less power at Spielberg. For the AMG that would mean about 40 horsepower less. I'm not sure if that's exactly correct, but close enough and you can verify that with the telemetry HUD. Meanwhile most turbos probably still handle that altitude just fine without major difference to power delivery. At Ibarra you're somewhere around 400hp which is not great coming down from 520 horsepower at sea level. Aero is a different beast altogether of course so your mileage may vary when it comes to overall pace difference.
I would say that formula is bang on the money and it’s insane how they have simulated that! That’s exactly how it looks and feels, like I’m 100 plus hp down and driving in a lower class of car and the lap times show that too. The Merc at Ibarra feels like I’m driving a mini bus with 10 people up a hill, on the long straight and I can almost feel myself trying to rowboat it along haha. If the game explained that, it would feel clever rather than it feeling like they have messed the bop up entirely.
