Automobilista 2 V1.3.1.1 & Racin´ USA Pt2 RELEASED - Now updated to V1.3.2.0

I have to go by the racing I watch, and I guess what I see is that beyond a certain point, the driver can't it back and he just has to hold his foot on the brakes until the car stops. I don't think you disagree--the question is more at what point that happens.

I've watched more GT4 racing than GT3 racing (IMSA Michelin Pilot Challenge series in the US), and I don't see many drivers getting to too far sideways before it's gone. The game as it exists now feels about the same with GT4.

In the 2021 NASCAR cars, they could get pretty sideways and save it. But they are saying this won't be the case with the 2022 car--it will be more like an Indy Car in that the point at which you completely lose the car will come sooner than before.

So, in sim racing it should and does vary from car to car.

But I replied not so much to reply to your comments but to ask Reiza to please just stabilize the physics/tires etc. of the existing cars as soon as possible--tell us to learn to drive the cars as they exist and if I don't like a particular car then I should drive something else or drive the car in another sim if I like it better there. The great thing about the 1.3 release is that there is a pretty common opinion that if there are remaining problems, they are pretty small.

What I want most is to be at the point where we'll no longer have to relearn how to drive every car with every monthly release (okay, that's a bit of an exaggeration ). Please just decide to be done with the existing cars for the next year and move onto focusing on new content and overall game development.

After a period of time, I'm sure some needed changes will arise (as has been the case with existing content on ACC, R3E etc.) and they should be made. But that doesn't need to happen every month.

 

I can second this. Just a great little addon to AMS2, now I can't race without it!

 

I’ve been able to reproduce this at the Nurburgring 24-hour configuration at the T1/T2 sequence with GT3, GT4 and Group A cars. So far, P3 was the exception, where the cars are pretty manageable throughout.

Once you go beyond a certain angle on those tight corners, there is no counter steering or easing-off that will save you from a full spin.

This is with the latest public release.

 

Surely there is a point of no return for when you cannot recover the car otherwise you would never ever see anyone spin in a professional race. What that point is exactly may be open to conjecture.

 

Right. I think the argument right now is that that point might be a little too soon. But this is just my uneducated guess, no IRL racing experience.

 

Good point - and even better description of this issue.
But this problem of the "rate" of loosing grip/adhesion and regaining it is a general problem for all racing sims.
The problem is when the adhesion between rubber against tarmac breaks up - then the law governing this area in RL is nearly impossible to simulate.
At least on a home computer in real time.

Some years ago I discussed this with a scientific engineer on a visit at Goodyears research unit at their Colmar Berg race track.
And his explanation was that when the adhesion breaks up then some kind of "chaotic" law takes over that has to be described in bifurcation theory.
Thats the reason why different racing sims either smooth or more abrubt loosing tire adhesion does not replicate what is happening in RL.
Because in RL when the tires in a corner is loosing adhesion then it happens in smaller and smaller steps.
Steps where the tire suddenly completely looses grip but then millisecs after completely regain grip again.
These small sequences of loosing and regaining grip happens faster and faster until either the driver by his inputs is able to lower the sideways forces on the tires
- or the tires just "give up" and the car does uncontrolled slide out.
Skilled drivers in RL is able to keep the car on this knives edge for a long time - because the regaining part is pretty symetrical to the loosing part and include all the small regaining and loosing steps.

How bifurcation and chaos are related?
A bifurcation occurs when a small smooth change made to the parameter values () of a system causes a sudden 'qualitative' or topological change in its behavior.

EDIT: In my explanation is missing that in RL while the tires are approaching to give up then its because the small steps of lost adhesion is becomming longer than the small steps of regain adhesion.
And when the driver are about to succeed to save the car then its because the opposite relation is about to be established between lost adhesion steps and regain adhesion steps.
OK?

 

I have to agree with the above points, there is a definite issue after the last patch/update.
I've tried most cars this past week and apart from the below list, majority of the cars seem off.

DPi Cadillac
GTE cars
2019 Stock car
Formula Gen 1Mclaren
For me these cars seem spot on...

Diff fixed now the default setups are way off.
Or it's just highlighted how far off the tyre grip situation has become.

Example the BMW GT4 is very unstable, but reduce the number of clutches and it actually drives ok even if the inside wheel starts then to slip.

But GT3, and Formula 3 it's just seems to be a case of slip and grip everywhere, to the point it just becomes awful.
Not sure what happened, maybe it's a fix in progress but PCars 2 is haunting me lately lol.

I'm sure Reiza will fix it, but I would really like to see a very stable tyre/grip situation, (or is it a weight transfer issue) moving forward.

 

I’m in general agreement with all of this, but the new baseline for driving is still miles better than it was three months ago. I think the priority must be, as mention above, to now stabilise the driving experience. Having to constantly readjust handling expectations after each update has been a frustration for too long now. It’s entirely understandable at the moment though, given the huge bug Reiza uncovered at Christmas, but let’s hope we can get that solid baseline established soon.

 

What huge bug was discovered at christmas. Id rather have the driving experience improve all the time, than sit on smth that we know can be better.

 

I think it is more setup related now.The leaderbords are reset,so the physics should be not the case anymore.

 

Yeah, I know about the pre Christmas bug.

 

I don't really understand the complaints about the GT3 cars. I don't care if you can't drift them around corners, that's not how GT3 cars are meant to be driven. AMS2 tyre models have suffered from being too lenient to excessive slip angles in the past, so some toning down was probably in order.

It is true that some open-wheelers got a lot more challenging after the aero yaw stability update, now the car is no longer glued to the road even at low speeds and you can actually lose the rear on corner entry. Apart from maybe some fine tuning, I think it's an improvement.

 

Agreed, GT3 shouldn’t be chucked around.
But also agree that the new patch makes all GTE, 3 and 4 cars very edgy. The rear is very snappy on the throttle and sensitive to steering inputs, kinda like the Super V8. Maybe it’s the baseline setup … it does need some work for the lazy people like me hehe.

hopefully we’ll see some modern cars, TCR, new F4 and scheduled races coz AMS2 would become top sim. But for now… back to ACC

 

It might just be me but I've noticed with the Formula Ultimate and vaguely the Formula Reiza that they just don't feel connected to the road at all for me, I dont know what exactly it is but there's something very unnatural about driving it to me and this has been a problem with them for as long as I can recall
Might be a default setup thing or simply me not adjusting to them but I don't know

 

Add a click or two of rear wing. The formula ultimate's default aero balance has always been a bit too far forward. It won't drastically change the feeling of the car, but it'll cure a bit of rear end instability.

I will say the Formula Reiza feels a lot worse after the last update, feels like the rears overheat more easily.

 

Hopefully some day they add proper ERS mode controls. It's a huge part of current F1 strategy and especially with iRacing's version of the W12, the Formula Ultimate is lagging behind a bit in detail.

 

Ye. I am not sure how ERS is actually working. It is deploying automatically nothing you can do to manage it.

 

Interestingly I find the GT's much better since they are "livelier", but contrary to your message, I still don't find them as edgy as ACC for example during corner exit. I quite like the idea that whacking the throttle flat out of a turn doesn't just let you accelerate like a rocket, but forces some throttle control to regain traction. Overall the sim is by far my favourite right now, I had some incredible fun over the weekend with some good online races.