Automobilista 2 October 2022 Development Update

Both those mentioned the Ai was really good and is currently very good. Each Ai can be changed to our desire. Most attention to the Ai lately has been the ovals with the CART cars. I think they got confused and thought rubbing is racing in all categories, open wheel too lol. Most the hate you hear about iracing is from he said she said and they’ve never tried it. I’m most likely on IRacing’s naughty list but when an atta boy is deserved I’ll give it

 

"Editing your 2 mentioned ini files was only the rather mundane part of tweaking the AI behaviour."
Ok rereading my comment I should probably not have used the word "mundane" - because it sounds patronizing.
Because as I faintly recall I used a lot of time myself editing all the different AI param lines in the individual track.ini

Where you could influence the AI behaviour a lot.

Ahh and I suddenly remember this too:

 

Would love to make Max Verstappen AI or Latifi AI

 

Yeah at least in NR2003 you could influence the different AI drivers a lot.
You could probably even create a team fight between a virtual Kevin Magnussen and Grosjean

 

Could you make Mazespin AI?

 

Never seen this before, where is this mod availible?

 

Don't worry, found it!

 

I hope they do Sonoma or other very rollercoaster like circuits

 

Welp this brings back a lot of memories, I think I spent more time editing all the parameters than driving the cars. I actually think AMS2 has the potential for something similar, you can make drivers better or worse on different tracks, GP4 and GPL also had those features. This is why I see the most potential of any sim in AMS2 for single player, you can edit the AI a little in RF2 but its much more complicated.

 

Custom AI files actually work well in AMS2.

For example, make Ayrton and Alain very likely to "always" finish where they would irl (basically top 2, top 3). It works.

However, like I said before, there are underlying issues with the AI where the racing itself is inconsistent. AI going too slow, too fast, too grippy, out of track, etc, all of that reported on their respective feedback thread. Apparently there is no action taken by the player to minimize that, hence why I call them "underlying issues".

I fail to understand why the steelguy got very mad at me for pointing that out...

Once Reiza sort out those underlying issues, I think racing the AI in AMS2 will be pretty satisfactory.

 

And just like the endless AI values of rFactor 1, most of these numbers did nothing but give a false sense of complexity in a fairly simplistic AI back in the day.

 

AI is tuned for every series, as is the FFB. Not polished to a shine yet, but there is a lot more going on under the hood than just generic settings. With so many series and track layouts in the game, we can start to understand why things sometimes take longer than we want.

 

Do you think AMS 2 uses more simplified AI than NR 2003? Wow.

 

I agree, and some car track combos are better than others. I think in the spring, Rezia should do a project (like they have with the physics of the cars) to bring their older tracks back up to spec. Reiza's newest tracks, especially spa 70 are a sight to behold. Would be cool to see their art team make a 2nd pass on the oldest tracks and then try to fix the worst of the ai track cutting issues and general AI weirdness.

All to come in time I suppose. Reiza has let us down yet... (minus release dates)

 

Mojave...it's fab. Look forward to you featuring it on your stream!

 

Do you happen to know a good AI open wheel combo?

Again, this is a sincere request. I do want to have good races with the AI, as I'm currently unable to spend any time on league racing or even LFM.

Edit: basically what I'm asking is which track+open wheel has been polished so far.

 

Perhaps the reason is because, as he stated, you are painting an entire situation with a single stroke. Of course there are many acknowledged problems with the AI (@CrimsonEminence has acknowledged them over and over again) and even the global AI parameters are not done being tweaked...and then there are all the car and track-specific ones to handle.

Despite that, OVERALL, the AI are already as good as probably any in any sim to date besides iRacing's unique approach that can only be done in an iRacing environment (otherwise, every other dev would just copy it if they were willing to dedicate that level of resources).

There are people having enjoyable SP races every day. It's not so solid that you can roulette wheel pick any series at any track layout and be sure it will be great, but it is a long way from being fundamentally broken or unworkable. Ovals, as the newest addition to the game, are the worst at this point. It's pretty obvious to us sim racers that the AI needed for an oval is drastically different from that needed for a road course. Like everything Reiza, the ambition is 100/100 and the ability to deliver is also 100/100--but in slow motion due to their relatively tiny size!

Many people (especially from certain parts of the world) might have said to Reiza just forget about ovals. In the short run, that would have allowed more time to focus on some road course issues. But AMS 2 has its own time zone. Wait one year (yes, admittedly a long time and can be frustrating) and then let's reassess whether ovals are working well and whether it was a good and popular addition to the sim.

In the meantime, what sim (besides iRacing) has great quality oval racing (including AI)? When you look at it from that industry-wide perspective, you realize it is better to have some patience so that there will be at least one decent-quality alternative to iRacing...eventually.

 

The thing here is that like there is a color for all tastes, what I find "good" or tolerable might not be for you. I enjoy a dynamic AI that can make mistakes and have mechanical issues, and can look past some weird moves or lines they might take. I had some good fun doing a short 10 lap race at Interlagos in the FV10 G1, was it perfect? No they did some rather dubious moves on turn 1, was it fun for me? Yeah, they did not crash me and had some good battles.

There is no perfect AI, there is great, good, mediocre, bad and awfull AI, I feel AMS2 is in the good category right now overall, and I am talking about everything about it, not just the way they behave, but how you can customize them. Now, reading all about Iracing AI has tempted me to take a 1 month subscription to see what its all about, so lets see.

 

Question, if I follow Renato, do I get notifications when he posts something like the December dev update?

 

I am also going to say something here that will get taken the wrong way, I am sure, but I will tell the story anyway:

As some people know, I am the "oldest" (probably in both senses) internal tester at Reiza. I drive real race cars and karts and can handle anything/everything in AMS/AMS 2 with at least some competence. Every time there is a new car released, I am convinced someone forgot to do any AI tuning for it--because the AI are annoying me on the track even in Practice sessions. Within whatever time it takes me to actually learn how to drive the vehicle properly (braking points, cornering capabilities, etc.), suddenly the AI has smartened up--and it's not because they have neural capabilities. The difference is I am no longer the mobile chicane or moron you see on the Ring videos of professional drivers needed to occasionally dodge around slow or erratic vehicles. Once I gain competence, I can drive in harmony with the AI (though, as usual, not every series is calibrated perfectly yet, so sometimes some % adjustment is required if you really want to focus on a favourite series).

The high-end open-wheel vehicles are exponentially more difficult to drive than the "regular" sports cars--in real life. The addition of down force and the overall pace is just at a level that the average person could not drive competitively for any length of time without quite a bit of practice and preparation. It is an equal challenge to tune AI for such high-end requirements. Video/console games have convinced many people that you can hop in a modern F1 car and interact and have fun with our famous real-world driver compatriots. Not going to happen in the real world. Not going to happen in any sim attempting to replicate anything even close to the real world.

An example are the pre-electronics, super high horsepower turbo, manual transmission F1 cars from the 80's. When I get in one of those in the game, using proper H-pattern shifter with pedal clutch, I am just astonished at the skill level required to manoeuvre and balance those cars, let alone race them. They literally scare me--and I am on a screen in my house--more than tamer race cars I have driven in real life. It would take me hours of laps in a real one of those just to get to the level I could drive it at 90% and try to do a decent lap time.

So, just a note of caution, that sometimes (not always), we the player are one of the major problems with the AI. As a result, I cannot judge the quality of many of the open-wheel series because it would require more time than I have to be able to drive at the normal 110 level I do with series that are calibrated. I know there are issues with cars trailing on the grass too often in certain places, and few other oft-repeated concerns, but when I can do competitive lap times consistently with the AI, most of the problems seem to vanish. The AI is now quite realistic in terms of small errors and misjudgements. The custom AI can really help certain series shine if you are trying to replicate a real-world group of past drivers. Each passing update of the general and series-specific AI makes it better...slow, but sure.

Let's start at the beginning. Can we drive competitive laps in the basic F-Trainer? And can we race with them? Yes, for me. If you can, too, we should start a ladder moving up the difficulty chain and compare notes (not just you and me and not here, but in a thread that can help identify the most urgent issues for the devs). But it is frustrating when people like @CrimsonEminence can hop in a car and blow away my lap times that I may have spent hours honing by the second lap....sometimes the first lap. So, we have to be humble while pursuing these AI issues.