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Automobilista 2 Custom Force Feedback - Overview & Recommendations

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Karsten Hvidberg, May 30, 2020.

  1. Peter Stefani

    Peter Stefani Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I didn't have time to delve deep into what Kuku actually did, but I do know that when I don't think about the FFB, (while driving) that's when it's best. Somehow it's just really balanced and controlled throughout all the ranges and phases of driving. Something with balance and blending.
    I found with the DeltaX I was able to lower the FX a bit and still retain the same detail. Previously the FFB Histogram would generally be centered around the middle forces, but now there is more activity spread across the whole spectrum of the histogram, which would seem to indicate that the forces are more evenly balanced and controlled in their own relative force areas. Each car is different too, so it's quite interesting to watch.
     
  2. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Well-Known Member

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    Well you have hit the nail on the head with the term blending.
    The key element was the change in the way centering works.
    Previously it was like this, in a sort of predefined fixed value.

    (centering 0.52)
    (trail_strength_feel 0.13)

    (force_scale (* 1.7 (/ 0.22 centering)))

    but I always had a penitent for the blended system from older versions.
    (trail_scale (- 1 (min 1 (* 3 lfb_slider))))

    (centering (blend (- 1 trail_scale) 0.22 0.5))
    (force_scale (* 1.7 (/ 0.22 centering)))

    But the self alignment was quite variable depending on where you had your lfb slider set.
    in 4.6 , the preset trail_strength _feel , seems to work well, so keeping that ( but its adjustable at same time in file and can lessen drag on wheel if lowered ), I found that incorporating the centering value into the blend formula like this , felt more dynamic.

    (trail_strength_feel 0.13)

    (centering (blend (- 1 trail_strength_feel) 0.52 0.5))
    (force_scale (* 1.7 (/ 0.22 centering)))

    It seems to self align more like real life. and reacts to velocity and wheel angle etc. so instead of snapping back at the same sort of speed and directly back to center it slows down as center approaches, You can test this by seeing what happens in your own car, its initially fast but then tapers off.
    The actual value is up to each individual, I find around 0.42 best for my wheel, and with a slightly lower trail value.

    PS:
    Also if you like a more heavy wheel but dont want to upset the balance of rack vs effects scales etc at top of file you can increase the force scale in this line.

    (force_scale (* 1.7 (/ 0.22 centering)))

    and it will strengthen the overall it seems. maybe this is useful for lower torque wheels..
     
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  3. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Well-Known Member

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    V2 Deleted

    Found an issue with loss of useful feel with some cars , while others felt perfectly fine.
    the variation in tires in Ams2 is tricky.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2021
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  4. Peter Stefani

    Peter Stefani Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Thanks for taking the time to explain the center blending, makes total sense now.
     
  5. Simon Ford

    Simon Ford New Member Reiza Backer

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  6. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Well-Known Member

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    Right I think I've cracked it, and the fix was hiding there the whole time. :confused:

    In terms of odd oversteer feelings and the relax timing feeling out between yaw and oversteer. The fix was hiding in the Desmos graph link in the file.
    #relax_os used for over-steer: relax_os

    The numbers in the file didn't match to what was in this original calculation ( done along time ago in early development I suspect).
    Im not sure when this changed, but once these values put in the file whole thing came together.

    (relax_os_line2_start_y 0.0008)
    (relax_os_pos 0.00144)
    (relax_os_width 0.00300)
    (relax_os_coef -0.015)

    Then secondly I finally worked out the newer static force reduction system and got it feeling much more like in rFuktor 4.4 which always gave my weak little wheel some smooth steady weight without overdoing it, and not getting that looseness on light load.
    Im not at all sure how it will translate to high end wheel, but you will probably need to use more power steering than recent times, which is good because that means the system is working as intended

    So anyway here is the Real Delta-X_V2 ;)

    **Edit V2.1 , with further revised Relax Os

    Edit: V3 with new old oversteer and yaw system
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 18, 2021
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  7. neal

    neal Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I've tried your latest now and still don't really get a good feedback when the front wheels lock or lose grip. I wonder if it is to do with LFB or FX settings. I found a nice setting when I used to used the last NuScorpii settings he made for those two values, but tend to want to have them at 0 (for my DD wheel). Not sure if that is wise any more. LFB seems mostly to make the centre more stiff which I quite like. any suggestions? and thanks anyway for what you have done so far, it is quite incredible.
     
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  8. tUMi

    tUMi Member

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    Excellent work with the Delta-X V2 tune, Kuku! ;) The high end file feels very natural and well balanced on my Simucube 2 Sport wheelbase when driving with GTE class cars and Formula V12. Weight of the wheel is spot on, not too heavy and also not too loose. :)

    I made a little bit of fine-tuning with my AMS2 in-game FFB settings. With your Delta-X Tune V2 high end file I'm now using 37 (gain) / 9 (LFB) / 28 (FX) / 7 (damping a.k.a power steering strength).
     
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  9. neal

    neal Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I agree @tUMi it feels incredibly natural, I used the same settings as yours above for my Accuforce. I just had a go in the McLaren F1 GTR and it is beyond words. I had a quick multi class race with GT4s and was so confident I was overtaking them on the outside of Paddock Hill bend, a bend that for most years has terrified me. and just to make sure I did it a good few times. The sense of speed too is so much greater I find in this sim. tbh the McLaren feels too good to be true, but I'm finding now that the astonishing cars like the F1 GTR really does feel astonishing to drive, the performance is just scarily awesome yet incredibly exhilarating.
    Please Riza I've waited since last Nov (orig date for release) for old Spa. Pretty please.
     
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  10. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Well-Known Member

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    I get a fairly good lock up feel and can tell which front tyre is locked etc. , so not sure why you dont on DD, but I would have thought you would want some FX rather than 0, as scrub and tear effects are part of that , and may play a part of the overall brake feel...

    I feel like there's some adjustment needed to slip effects now.

    I believe you can increase this line in the file to induce slip feel earlier
    (long_factor 1.16)
    Default is actualy 1.0 , so I have already tweaked that up a bit historically, but do feel like Slip timing has possibly been upset by other changes.

    It may be a case of the Slip calculation,

    (slip_crossover_pos 0.245) #slip effect graph: slip2
    (slip_crossover_width 0.50)
    (slip_crossover_line1_slope 0.2)
    (slip_crossover_line2_start_y 0.15)
    (slip_crossover_line2_end_y 1.15)

    or understeer relax need revisiting.

    (relax_us_line2_start_y 0.0008) #relax_us used for under-steer: relax_us
    (relax_us_pos 0.0011)
    (relax_us_width 0.00263)
    (relax_us_coef -0.01)

    but its a little hard to work out, and others on here have a better handle on that stuff than me, but lowering both Pos and Width seem to bring on slip feel earlier.
     
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  11. Shadak

    Shadak Active Member

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    0 FX willl just rob you off effects no matter the type of wheel, i run 23 i think on DD1. FX here is physical effects, not canned artificial ones.
     
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  12. Dean Ogurek

    Dean Ogurek Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    I run FX at 30 or more with SC1 but, also use a fair amount of filtering and damping. For the FX to be felt, I may set FX higher than most using DD. but, I can clearly detect front-wheel lock-up when it occurs.
     
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  13. TheMarrinator

    TheMarrinator New Member

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    First post here.

    Just wanted to say thank you for all the work you guys put in to these custom FFB files.

    I have just tried the high end file from @Kuku Maddog

    For me it`s pretty much perfect. I can feel everything the car is doing, it`s like the missing piece of the puzzle and has transformed the game for me, I sort of started to lose hope with AMS2 but this has shown me how good the core of the game is, the fundamentals.
    To be able to tap into what`s under the hood and bring it out this way is fantastic.

    My settings :
    Gain: 70
    LFB: 30
    FX: 60
    Damping: 50

    Fanatec CSL elite 1.1 (PS4)
    Sens: Auto
    FF: 100
    DRI: -2 (or -1 to 0 Depending on the car)
    FEI: 70
    Force: 120
    SPR: off
    DPR: 100 (redundant anyway I think)

    Porsche RSR74 with these settings...
    Amazing experience.
     
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  14. ijac

    ijac New Member

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    I'm on a T300 and using the DeltaX v2 T300 custom file.

    I think I have dialed in the FFB settings to a good place. Feels pretty good overall. But I'm curious what settings you are using with a T300 @Kuku Maddog?
     
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  15. Peter Stefani

    Peter Stefani Active Member Reiza Backer

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    His settings are shown inside the FFB file.
     
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  16. ijac

    ijac New Member

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    Oh didn't know that. Perfect. Thanks.
     
  17. Magnus

    Magnus Active Member

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    Work has kept me away from my rig (and the internet) for the last six weeks and I’m feeling pretty left behind with regard to ffb custom files. Add in a CSL DD that arrived today and I’m going to have to sit down and play around quite a bit.

    Which leads me to my question. @Kuku Maddog - is your Delta file based on the rFuktor files with Damping still controlling the power steering? Or is it based more from the Default files? Apologies if this information is given earlier, I read through but couldn’t find anything.
     
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  18. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Well-Known Member

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    Hope you enjoy your new CSL , let us know how it feels with default and custom .
    It’s still just the same rFuktor set up you probably last used, it’s just a fresh tune .
     
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  19. Magnus

    Magnus Active Member

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    Thanks for the info Kuku. I’ll probably start with the rFuktor I have and try to dial in the new wheelbase and then look forward to seeing what you’ve created. You’ve been incredibly active making so many tweaks and changes over the many past months since custom ffb files were shared it’ll be interesting to see what you’ve done.

    I’m also just looking forward to getting behind the wheel again…and trying out the new content.
     
  20. Hank Madison

    Hank Madison New Member

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    I'm enjoying @Kuku Maddog's V2 file. Wondering if there's any way to get some sense of forward weight transfer under braking? I can feel weight transfer side to side in turns, and would love to get that forward shift feel for trail braking. Is that possible? If so, what would the settings be? Thanks for your hard work, everyone!
     

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