Automobilista 2 Custom Force Feedback - Overview & Recommendations

ATMOS V1.5.7.X - BASE + Initial NDef_imm



CHANGELOG: BASE + Initial NDef_imm
(only further changes compared to the previous BASE + Partial Old_D_raw version):

- Implementation of the new variables necessary to obtain specific customization for single car, in order to align the sensations for cars not only to physics but for how Reiza interprets them in its second "custom+" profile differently also called immersive;
-Implementation of the Code necessary to introduce the "Linearly Decrease Cutoff Freq As Velocity Incaceses" for LP optimizations;

Following the above indications, the file code was modified to prepare the implementation (in this initial version) of these first personalized characteristics:

- Vehicle_accel_mz
- Vehicle_braking_mz
- Vehicle_grip
- Vehicle_yaw_mult
- Vehicle_damping
- Vehicle_friction
- Vehicle_lp_cutoff
- Vehicle_lp_cutoff_min
- Vehicle_lp_vel_scale
- Vehicle_engine_vibe
- Vehicle_flatspot
- Vehicle_scrub_mult_front
- Vehicle_scrub_mult_rear
- Vehicle_Rodnoise

Therefore the entire code of the previous file was hooked to the variables mentioned above.

I just ask you to mentally start from the beginning by resetting your brain otherwise feedback of superiority or inferiority is absolutely useless to me if based solely on useless comparisons ... this is another file and in the future will even most, with others Reiza implementations!!

Info for Tuning:
- this version of ATMOS 1.5.7.x "BASE+Initial NDef_Imm" file does not have tuning optimization and is identical to the first "BASE" and to the second "BASE+Partial Old_D_raw" to allow you to immediate comparison (only the resistance on tires and power steering have been slightly modified), if instead you have modified the first or the second BASE file enter the same values to compare it better;
- however, if you are using it for the first time, I have no indications to give, tune it and adjust it as you see fit.


I remember that the file is a little pumped in the values and settings and therefore has a little excessive movement and the powerful DDs could have oscillations if guided without the hands, please focus on consistency and coherence, everything will be reduced to finished development ... I hope next week with the last file (for now) ... then in the future i start the optimization or tuning of these files.
Tested on the last AMS 1.5.6 and beta 1.5.8.2 versions

EDIT: This is just a first implementation of car optimizations, for example, if you take gt3 gen1 (or any other single class) and focus on scrub (or on the braking/accel, or on engine vibration, or on damping, or on friction, etc), you should feel different nuances between one car model and another (not just the physics therefore) and this especially in dd steering wheels which are much more sensitive.
As with the Reiza profiles (Custom & Custom+), it is not certain that the versions of the ATMOS Immersive file will be liked more than the Raw versions, in fact the opposite often happens but it is nice to be able to have the possibility of choosing.

-----------------------------------------

Spoiler: OLD CHANGELOG FOR BASE + Partial Old_D_raw VERSION

CHANGELOG (BASE + Partial Old_D_raw version):

New code implemented in the slip:
-calculation of tires average lateral slip front & determination of the front lateral scrub breaking point;
-calculation of tires average lateral slip rear & determination of the rear lateral scrub breaking point;
-calculation of tires average longitudinal slip front & determination of the front longitudinal scrub breaking point;
-calculation of tires average longitudinal slip rear & determination of the front longitudinal scrub breaking point;
-calculation of tires slip_speed_rear_avg;

New code implemented in the yaw:
-allow yaw sense only on oversteer;
-calculation of the oversteer multiplier;
-calculation of reduce_load_norm;
-calculation of slide_lat_avg_rear_yaw;
-overall redetermination of the yaw following the changes indicated above;

New redetermination of the scrub effect, now following the changes in the code indicated above:
-insertion of the lateral break points (front and rear) into the scrub;
-insertion of the longitudinal break points (front and rear) into the scrub;
-insertion of the slip_speed_rear_avg only in the rear scrub, now the effect in the rear is reduced if sliding;

New redetermination of the tear effect, now following the changes in the code indicated above;
-insertion of the slip_speed_rear_avg only in the rear tear, now the effect in the rear is reduced if sliding;

New code implemented in the damping:
- new code for increase damping on oversteer with compensation;
- new code for damping on low lateral force and under 150 km (lateral and velocity compensation);
- new code for reduce damping if is sliding (sliding reduction).

If you are interested you can find the second file ATMOS 1.5.7.x BASE + Partial Old_D_raw version here:
Automobilista 2 Custom Force Feedback - Overview & Recommendations

Spoiler: OLD CHANGELOG FOR BASE VERSION

CHANGELOG (BASE):
What's new in how objects work (with or without new code in the file):
- New "3 main_dials" now sets to 1.00;
- New "tyre_resistance & timing" now calculated on 5 moments and not on 3 (the functioning and the formula was misinterpreted in the previous files because it was unclear);
- Center_Full low_velocity (0 Kmh) during acceleration morphs to high_velocity (250Kmh);
- Centering recalibrated and force_scale set to manual (small differences on both values bring great benefits so I didn't use the formula);
- The code relating to velocity and the gyroscope has been slightly modified, so now all velocity variables can basically start from a value of 1.00 (modify anyway if you like);
- Removed the front_grip_loss_feel (this was an error in my previous files the formula was misinterpreted and instead the rear_grip_loss_feel alone was enough to get what you want);
- The follow_weight dynamics are now 5 different (accel, brake, bump, road and suspension);
- The "front & rear drive_torque_feel" are now calculated differently or rather both in an increasing manner and as a function of the speed from 0 to 250 km where above we will obtain the maximum longitudinal forces;
- The RELAXES have all been disabled (OS, US and YAW) and the code inhibited, the car is very balanced without them (but if you want to re-enable them you can do it by deleting the # symbol both in the objects and in the code below relating to the Relax);
- Now you can also set the smoothness for textures and for both large bumps (not just for micro bumps);
- New scrub and tear values added, now with additional variables to change on both effects to your liking (we have hardness, damping and effect);

New code only:
- KART code move up before the dynamic code and enjoy this now this feature, it still to be tuned or WIP, we will do it later (code disabled if you want to do so, delete the # symbol in front of the respective lines);
- We have a new code "if isTRUCK...." i.e. I have implemented, if you need a different melody from the base, a specific code for the TRUCKS to be set to your liking, it still to be tuned or WIP, we will do it later (code disabled if you want to do so, delete the # symbol in front of the respective lines);
- Added rolloff, offTrack and offTrackRollOff code to many items of the code such yaw, scrub and road_effects (this will make more sense later with the other files that implement the reiza code);
- the Slide variables are no longer connected to the scrub (even only to the rear one) but only to the original Slide variables (this will make more sense later with the other files that implement the reiza code);
- New load_norm_wheel, now the value is no longer fixed at 250 but is variable based on the weight and mass of the car, this allows you to lighten the load (the wheel) if you are in the air, on the grass or if you slip , furthermore the variable value will influence the way you feel curbs and bumps (depending on the car) and enhances surface variations as happens a lot when sliding on dirt roads (RALLY is great fun) or bump roads and reduce that sensation of weight which is always perennial (in subsequent files this change will be more noticeable when we implement the REIZA code);
- The REAR has been removed in the ATMOS. Not because it is wrong but because the file already has the entire rear (slide, grip, textures, curbs, bump and all the effects) and does not need to be implemented as in the original file because only the front variables are calculated there.

I stopped bothering you for the moment, the file is a neutral base that can be used by everyone, at the beginning of the file I inserted some simple recommended value ranges to first experiment with the cursors in the game and if necessary modify the main_dials as desired or go directly to the individual objects ... as regards the high range/DD, as usual, limit the Lfb and the Damping as much as necessary, raise the GAIN to your liking, trying not to reach either clipping or any oscillations, and finally raise Fx to your liking... the medium/low range on the other hand can also risk the use of the Lfb, on the Logitech G920 I use 95-25-50-25 but I won't deny that I also really like 70/80-50/ 80-50-25 ...

If you are interested you can find the first file ATMOS 1.5.7.x BASE version here:
Automobilista 2 Custom Force Feedback - Overview & Recommendations

-----------------------------------------

The next file?? BASE + Partial NDef_imm

Have fun, I hope so....

 

A rig is of course always more stable but not everyone has the money and space for it. I also felt noticeable gridding and notching on the R9 compared to the R21, which also makes it more unstable and has a tendency to swing. Ams2 also tends to be very restless with the oscillation of the wheel (even with the defaults). It took me a long time to get these vibrations under control. You see, it's not just your base, there are other reasons too

 

A big up for you and for this very interesting work that you are carrying out.
Even if sometimes I notice some excesses (on curbs and bumps) for now these files are the ones that give the best concreteness in terms of coherence, slip, movement and vitality. I don't have the ability to evaluate the code in the file or their meaning, but I'm fun and satisfying feelings, so I'm rushing to keep playing.
Please know that I am already looking forward to your next file, the new features and especially the future optimization of all these files.

 

You left me behind with the tests, my proposal is still valid but still not processed even if accepted.

Regardless, I'm still happy to test these new files only when you publish them and I really like the idea that they are developed on three different lines BASE, RAW and IMMERSIVE. The thing I like most about all of them, in addition to the sensations, is that now we finally talk about code and new features again.

I also find this last file very valid after the first tests and it is another particularly fascinating alternative to explore further.
EDIT: GT3 1-2, GT1, Stock and many Formula are beautifull...

But at this point the curiosity is too much. What do you think or plan to include in the next "Partial NDef_Imm" (Immersive)? and why stop with the development and then complete them later?

 

I don't stop the development, I stop the new publication after the next file which will implement (hopefully and without errors) other features of the Immersive always with the code calculated and derived only from the rFuctor (f/r, l/r, lat&long dry, aero load reduction and chassis ... and maybe other code).

The drafts of the future files also already exist but now it's time to stop (after the next release), calibrate these, trying to make everything as pleasant as possible and wait for the development of the game in version 1.6.X to recalibrate everything and then complete the work with this files and only if necessary with the two others final files.

 

Did you manage to eliminate the oscillations of the steering wheel in AMS2? In my R16, they are sometimes very aggressive. Could you tell me how you did it? Thank you very much!

 

Unfortunately there is no main switch where you can eliminate this. There are many, many factors in the file itself that influence it. Everything has to be harmoniously coordinated. The combination of the custom file with the in-game and base settings make the difference. The file is the most important thing and together with the factors given below you can achieve even better results

1. In-game gain (too high causes swinging)
2. In-Game FX (too high causes pendulum)
3. In-game damping (better left at 0, higher causes swinging)
4. Steering angle too low causes swaying (set 900 or 1080 degrees in the base)
5.Steering angle adjustment in game (the higher set, the more sway may occur), but is not a problem if you set the base to 900 or 1080.
6.Increasing vehicle specific FFB over 100% causes swaying (In my files)
7. How does your base process the signals
8. The wheel you are using (light, small wheels swing more) can be corrected with “inertia” or damping in the basic settings

 

@Stakanov , is there any variable that I can adjust to feel opponent car collisions on the wheel? I like how the ATMOS V1.5.7.X - BASE + Initial NDef_imm feels but need more feedback on the wheel to know when opponents are bumping into the car. Additionally, when turning hard, I feel the wheel almost tends to self-correct almost as thought there is some assisted counter steering occuring. I have the Logitech G-Pro DD Racing wheel.

 

Thanks,
will I feel high curbs at high speed with the La Prima™ Direct Drive Wheelbase 12Nm? Or will you need more nm?

 

No, on the contrary, the more force you use, the less you will feel. You will feel less with 15Nm than with 10Nm because you are constantly fighting with this high force and these high forces will take away the fine details and therefore more feedback. It has more to do with the dynamic range of a base. In addition, there are bases that have features (filters) that can correct this, such as Simucube2/Assetek or VRS. This has to do with the static force that these bases can handle better than others. But don't promise yourself that it will be perfect. I also have enough feedback from high curbs with the Moza R21. It's always a matter of personal taste and which track and which cars you test it on. A lot is already given by Reiza with the physics of tracks and cars

 

@Stakanov
I actually have only tested your ATMOS 1.5.7.x BASE and ATMOS 1.5.7.x BASE + Partial Old_D_raw and not your new Initial NDef_imm file.

Overall both files feel really good, but unfortunately they are not usable on my Asetek Invicta wheelbase now, because of some strange behaviors on kerbs.

As an example -> Nürburgring Nordschleife - Hatzenbach section:
There are some tight corners and pretty high kerbs. If i slightly touch one of the high kerbs, while i turn into (a cambered) corner, i get some violent FFB peaks and an unexpected strong and fast countersteer effect, where my steering wheel almost knocks out of my hands.

It's pretty much reproducible in the following corner:


I really don't know why this happens. I don't have this strange behavior with other custom FFB files. As much as i would like to use your FFB file, the unexpected violent peaks in various high kerb situations makes it undriveable for me, unfortunately.

But i have to test, if this also happens with your new Initial NDef_imm file.

 

Hi Ernie,
i have the same problem with the file. I really like it so far, but i also have these strange "countersteering" or weight transfer issues like you. I only drove 12 laps Nordschleife with the file so far, but have the same at Hatzenbach (and sometimes happening at Hedwigshöhe/Wippermann chicane).

And at the Pflanzgarten jump, sometimes the wheel is acting strange when landing again, have lost the car one time because of this unexpected behaviour. Have to test and reproduce it more.

I use a Fanatec CSL DD 8nm and the ffb_custom_settings - ATMOS Mod V1.5.7.x (2-rFuktorBaseDpFr+Initial NDef_imm) file.

If @Stakanov sort this little bug out or has a tip what to modify, i will keep using his file for sure!

 

+1 to these countersteering effects (CSL DD 8Nm)

 

Sorry for the delay.... for now I go in and out of hospitals for routine checks ...

Thank you for the detailed and kind feedback it's just what I need....

For the curb/kerb bounce is easy to solve, for now I use all 4 wheels to calculate the effect and therefore in some cases the doubling leads to the jump, often when the jump is large the passage of the rears after the fronts creates the anomaly that you find ... this does not worry me because if I were not able to solve it with this configuration just put the original karsten code back with only two right and left kerbs and the file returns to being the same as all the others.
In fact, soon I will attach in this post the same 3 files released up to now with the original code for the curbs i.e. equal or identical to all the other files ... you should be ok .... LET ME KNOW IF IT SOLVES THE JUMP ANOMALY FOR YOU

 

Regarding the countersteering effect... I wanted to tackle it later as soon as I finished developing the files but nothing prevents me from doing some tests....

At the end of the file, in the damping code, try to disable this code by placing the # symbol in front of this lines:
- first those with the code in red (do a test);

Spoiler: First test

#increase damping on oversteer
#(oversteer_comp 2.0)
#(oversteer_comp (+ 0.5 (* oversteer_comp (- 1.0 oversteerMult))))
#(oversteer_comp (smooth oversteer_comp 0.5))
#(damping2 (* damping2 oversteer_comp))

- then those with the code in blue (do a test again by re-enabling the first ones)

Spoiler: Second test

#on low lat force and on low speeds only (under ~150 km/h)... not necessary a lot of damping.
#(lat_comp (abs lat_G))
#(lat_comp (+ 0.3 (* 0.7 (tanh (* 1.5 lat_comp)))))
#(vel_mod (max 0.0 (/ (abs vel_mag) 41.0)))
#(lat_comp (+ lat_comp vel_mod))

#if is sliding, reduce damping
#(l_slide (max 0.0 (- (abs (/ (+ FL_sl_lat RL_sl_lat) 2) 0.05))))
#(r_slide (max 0.0 (- (abs (/ (+ FR_sl_lat RR_sl_lat) 2) 0.05))))
#(l_slide (power l_slide 1.2))
#(r_slide (power r_slide 1.2))
#(slide_damping_reduce (- 1.0 (* (+ l_slide r_slide) 0.5)))
#(damping2 (* damping2 lat_comp slide_damping_reduce))

If in both tests the solution is partial, try keeping them all disabled ... otherwise it reactivates the rows as they were originally

 

@mikesch250 @GoobMB

Regarding the countersteering effect... if above not resolving (is possible) another solution could be applied, eliminate the oversteerMult from the yaw when in oversteer.

Disable this line with # symbol
#(Yaw_final (*yaw oversteerMult rolloff offTrackRolloff))

and insert this line under whitout the oversteerMult
(Yaw_final (*yaw rolloff offTrackRolloff))

now this multiplicative effect should not occur when in overstreet ... i hope!!!

 

Thanks for your input and for your work! I tested a few laps and no changes really helped that much. I reverted to the original file and set the DP setting ingame from 0 to 50 which gives a good improvement for me. Setting LFB from 0 to 10 and FX from 30 to 40. Gain is at 65.

The only little issue is now, sometimes when i breaking harder into a longer corner with little oversteer, I get a short "kick" to the opposite side in the wheel. The FFB feels if its off for a split second. I really have to hold the wheel tight after it kicks back in. I can reproduce this in the first right corner downhill after Sabine Schmitz Kurve (T13) into Hatzenbach on the ring. Maybe its because of the bump in the road?

And one general question:
How/What do i feel, if my FFB is clipping? I see some infos in the telemetry hud, but
what are the different bars for? Is there a documentation somewhere? Will to rule out that its not the FFB clipping what i am feeling.

 

I'm happy that your problem are more reduced with different setting , in this file it is very important to recalibrate the sliders differently, unlike the others here you can be more daring with the LFB and with the Damping, certainly lower the GAIN slightly to avoid oscillations but for the strongest DDs there is no lack of power if you reduce 1-5 points the gain and go up with others ... I'm talking exclusively about my mod...

but for my knowledge I would like to be sure that I understood you (my english is bad) ... what you mean that you "reverted to the original file" ... are you talking about the last 3 files posted today with the alternative original curb code or do you mean that you used the original files prior to the ones I posted today???

With which car do you get this short "kick" to the opposite side in the wheel and the FFB feels if its off for a split second ... I think it happened to me in the past and I had solved it, maybe it came back and I need to reduce something related to the slide in the code... I need to reproduce it and understand if it happens to you with various cars or just with a combination of them ... whether it's a bump I find it difficult, you drive off with various cars, brake violently and turn the steering it should always do so if it's a defect or it's a setting at the limit and it only occurs occasionally and therefore a few reductions are enough,...
or
I don't want you to be referring to the breaking point of the lateral and longitudinal scrub, when you slip at the moment of the wheel loses grip you feel this blow and then return to vibrate above the threshold... this file has this characteristic and perhaps you feel this and it just needs to be reduced.... let me know

For the widget FFB, different bar indicate difference force and full force are when more bare are used toghether ... the last bar are the max force near the clipping ... the clipping occur when the red bar are max or go bear the max and when the ffb line yellow hystory go up more then 100% ... if yellow line touch 100% for a moment is no clipping but if rest up for more you are in clipping and you feel the that the force of whell are dead or flat

 

@stakano

 

@Ernie @GoobMB @Racinglegend1234 @Michael Enright
do what @mikesch250 tried, use normal files (no the last 3 of today) and recalibrate the cursor, in this new ATMOS files the Damping in low range is 15-25, in the medium range 25-50 and in high dd 50 or above (try your taste but without defect), then low the gain lower until there are no more unnatural oscillations, not too much, just a few points of under your usual attitude (we need to use our powerful means but not necessarily to the limit) and finally also use a bit of LFB just to fill any gaps as if it were the salt in the foods, at the end raise the FX slider until you hear not too many effects or jerks or scrubs especially in oversteer or countersteer (remember that damping attenuates this effect)!!!

These files are much more similar in settings to the original Reiza profiles where is recommends other values which are instead used on the custom ones which almost all have very low lfb and damping. Maybe only the first file ATMOS BASE is most similar to other custom but not the others (Old_D_raw or NDef_Imm)