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Automobilista 2 Custom Force Feedback - Overview & Recommendations

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Karsten Hvidberg, May 30, 2020.

  1. Alegunner68

    Alegunner68 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Spent a bit of time today comparing 47 with 31 (as 31 seems popular with a few users)and default.
    31 feels totally connected to the track at all times which is good, although lacks in variation between high/low forces even with low lfb.
    47 feels generally good, but goes vague at times exiting some corners and in the compression at brands, where i'd imagine it should really load up.

    I still much prefer these files over default, but the one area the default excels at is the variation of forces especially in corners- the ffb really loads up nicely when accelerating through and out of them.

    Could be completely wrong but maybe some settings in these files are working against one and another (acceleration?), cancelling out certain forces that don't affect dd wheels.
    Any of this make sense?
     
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  2. Karsten Hvidberg

    Karsten Hvidberg Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Alegunner!

    The load up should be better in v48 again. It is the limit on high downforce load that is too strict in earlier versions.
    I am not 100% sure about the the going light coming out of corner issue, what Lfb are you running at?
    Is there a good car/corner combo that showcases the issue well?

    If you want more load in corners you can set power_steering down to 0.0, btw and raise the gain.
     
  3. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Active Member

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    would be good if the new scales in file like power steering , front slide and lat edge had a description next to them in .48
    can’t tell if they need adjusting or not .
     
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  4. Alegunner68

    Alegunner68 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Hi Karsten, it's during the exit as I start to straighten the wheel the ffb seems to drop off too quickly, almost the same feeling as going over the brow of a hill or locking the fronts.
    Running low lfb to get as much force variation as I can, tried at Brands gp in the f309 and porsche gt3.
    Seems to happen most in the fast mid field corners.
    If you can, try 31 and 47 back to back and you may see what I'm trying to explain.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2021
  5. steve montuno

    steve montuno Member

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    I'm still rocking 38 or 39 cant remember which now ,,slightly tweaked the engine vibe & road detail and its the best ffb i've had yet ,,,obviously some cars excel more than others due to physics but i couldn't be happier ,,,,

    Hey Karsten have you thought about putting a small section on the first page explaining how to tweak maybe 2 or 3 key features in the ini file for folks who are not quite getting the feeling they were hoping for , just so some folks who are struggling can grab one of your files and have a go at adjust it more to their ffb taste as i it must be hard trying to please all the folks with different wheels and different opinions of what the perfect ffb is .. just a thought.

    I don't think i'd be playing this game half as much if it wasn't for your custom file,,,, keep up the excellent work dude .
     
  6. Shadak

    Shadak Active Member

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    thats probably the acceleration effect to lighten the ffb slightly when tyres unload, it was to simulate unloading during hard acceleration, especially rear engine cars. not sure what wheel base you have but on DD1 the value in 47 was fairly low already, you can reduce or turn off with "Acel2" in the file.
     
  7. Alegunner68

    Alegunner68 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Cheers Shadak, I suspected it may have something to do with acceleration, I'll try what you suggested.
    On CSW2.5 btw.
     
  8. Shadak

    Shadak Active Member

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    Sorry it doesnt show signature on mobile page,
    Had a look at the file, its this one, try it at 0.0
    acc2_scale 1.0
     
  9. inthebagbud

    inthebagbud Member Reiza Backer

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    That's the effect i mentioned previously that has got better for me at least in ver 47
     
  10. Gert-Jan van Osch

    Gert-Jan van Osch New Member

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    Last week I did a test race at Simracingonline in AMS2 and a general remark is that FFB was not good. I already heard about and started reading parts of this forum and tried some of the silver-raw files, to see what the effect would be on my Thrustmaster T150 entry level racing wheel. I found that v45 wiht GT1 Porsche and Kyalami new version had good feedback on curves but feedback on especially on oversteer in a slip state to catch the car was not quite there yet. I also tried same settings on a few formula retro cars Brabham BT44 on 1975 silverstone layout but I do not get any sense of feedback in that combination.

    I also had a look at the setings file and some questions / ideas came to my mind with my background as electronics design with backgrounds in software and control systems.

    I had read somewhere that there is no documentation about the way the files work, but I have a few questions about the content of the file:
    1. What is the program language used or how are the functions calculated
    2. I assume that there is a standard sample rate that the new output is calculated, is the sample rate known?
    3. If this is treated as software and calculated can you do stuff like S2=S1; S1=S0; S0=Input.

    If so it is possible to make discrete filters where you can make a sort of equalizer where you boost or supress frequencies to improve the feel using IIR filters. Perhaps there is already software available that can inject noise or swept sines and determine the transfer response of steering wheels which can be used determine a transfer function which can compensate for the e.g. lack of feedback over curbs.

    I did not have time to dive into the "code", but I assume there are variables which are input from car model which are calculated in this file before being output to the ffb of the wheel or something like that. What are these values in the code.

    I have no exact knowledge of all the physics used in the custom ffb file but reading this thread I notice that some people have excellent results and some have trouble finding correct feedback behaviour...

    Maybe someone with a lot of inside information could provide me some information to see if my ideas are feasible to improve the feedback in the wheel or that the way this file works with the reiza code is completely different than I hope it does. It would be highly appreciated to get feedback or some people in this thread to elaborate on this idea.

    Kind regards Gert
     
  11. Karsten Hvidberg

    Karsten Hvidberg Well-Known Member

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    Hi Gert,

    1)
    It's lisp syntax, but not much more. No functions can be declared.
    Assignments are like:
    (a 1)
    that puts 1 in the "a" variable.

    The exception is if "a" is some function, like "smooth", if which case:
    (smooth arg1 arg2)
    returns the result of the smooth function given the 2 args.

    To assign function result to "a":
    (a (smooth arg1 arg2))

    2)
    Sample rate is 300hz or so.

    3)
    Yes.


    I hope this helps,

    Best,

    -K
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2021
  12. Alegunner68

    Alegunner68 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Didn't take much altering in the end to get it 47 how I wanted.
    Master rack up to 1.2
    Master road 1.75
    Power steering up to 0.2 made the most difference, feels great in all the cars I tried.
    All the relax centres up a bit.
    Large bump scale up a bit.
    70,15,60,1.
     
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  13. Raceracerace

    Raceracerace Member

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    it could be that 47 gets me off 45.

    took extensive notes with setup. bad rep of sim is now undeserved.

    i adjusted my settings in the meantime for 44 and 45, and now 47. lfb using high end on a lol ahem! tx wheel.... is 55, then 60 for fx, then 40 for damping. gain is 100 in the main but most cars bar 1 or 2 are down around 65-75 on a per car basis. (i adjust lfb and dampener later down as it opens up revealing more depth and detail. I left foot brake a lot and like texture and substance to the finer inputs, this all helps.)

    lfb as we know does the center, fx etc etc and gain moreso the curves, thus I try to blend all nicely and get that auto move/must correct feeling a car does.

    now you would not believe this, or maybe having used 47 as such you in fact do believe this: but its like I took a piece of large plastic, and its smooth on a straight but you know you are going over friction...and in the center on a turn it is scuffed...yes? and you feel that and the extra grip.

    In short, I base this on a shoe perhaps going over a large flat object and thus it has turned an inanimate object into the sense of moving across 4 tyres and load.

    well done on 47. oulton park short course (been great to drive and test on lately), p1 ginetta 558. the steering optics are better than ever. by which I mean how to resolve what to do, its detailed and gives perspective thus i feel its closer to driving than ever before. the pollution of that is gone in 47, so cool

    and i must state the brakes have become spongy-good, so thats great as well, real brake bounce and the steering resistance is good, so between the physics and the ffb, i think the game went to a whole new level.

    and also I welcome the lightness on accel too because its become like it probably should be, on accel you tend to skip over things as such, and the lightness reflects that well.

    obviously the best interpretation of this thing so far. :)

    edit: and now damping down to 30 -oooh thats the sign of a good file surely; and in response to that dropped lfb down to 52 from 55 - original was 50 prior version. willing to have that input there significant upside, but being a tx and a DD file it is - thus I see the graph clipping on those hard turns forcing a slight lowering - and the feel from this is overall improved; if the lfb is too high, the center steering resistance is too obtuse and not detailed enough its like someone slapping you with a block of wood. good balancing from me maybe because prior it was all 'dampened out' further than this. obviously a better wheel would provide better results. very happy with this 47 and outcome. I chose nordschlief 24/7 (track as well) to get some long sustained readings in there.

    see, 55 lfb clips and thus the wood-hit effect mid turn movement, but 52 retains the rubberised feel mid adjustment as well as curb feel. well done once more; a 2 point improvement may not seem like much, but eeking it out of this wheel though it be unintended consequence is only a good thing. overall is what I am more concerned with and as stated found this outcome very good.

    edit 2: since that 'very good outcome' thought I would keep going lol until it was not 'very good'. I got down to 20 dampening. My impression has once again improved, and I can definitely live with 20 dampening. it reveals details I formerly wanted hidden back in the 30s but its so good now.

    edit 3: and just so we're clear I test these all with proper suspensions. i.e no grip loss or none of that slidy stuff, example is why I am even typing this - I had to tune down my fast bump and the other one down a notch each (but NOT slow bump) even after I set up everything else (and forgot to do that, drivetain is 80 and 55, which could come down to 79 i guess). its important to add because the tyres are a part of the suspension and i used it half and half of course its better than before. and front spring is 152, and camber is down a degree front and back, and toe in on front .1 to keep it positive, back toe is -.4. drives wonderfully across a variety of tracks with minimal adjustment from that. brake at 95+% ur choice and front opening at 70 (maybe not the best for a long drive but it seems to help aero a fair bit or stability in turns with the air or some such maybe stabilizes the car better; but maybe that setting leaks elsewhere in the physics?) vehicle specific ffb is 75% on a tx wheel

    so with the ffb at 47, all that and the setup of the car at nordschleife, its an excellent sim. its bad rep is now definitely undeserved. not sure on realism but leaps and bounds is a word i otherwise use with everything

    edit 4: dampening now 10. its my opinion a tx wheel
    will need a lot of dampening as it does not do the detail as well, but with just 10 dampening this game revealed a lot more texture and useable texture at that -- some minor stuff still muddies things too much below that as 10 dampening seems to be a sweet spot and not much muddyness there (60 fx is heaps too, 50 some may like, between the 2 is a fine middle ground on a tx, but all in all they have a crystal and its being polished. plotting this 47 version on any quadrant graph you will probably find it further to the right and top and by a significant distance; I do not mean complete muddyness, its not gunky - rather its too much un-fine detail that could be finer, but at least I know the wheel is at a limit of sorts and the ffb is exceptional I would say...so 10 dampening means it brings to it all a clarity and cohesiveness, which is not a complaint).
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2021
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  14. Michael Enright

    Michael Enright Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I have same wheelbase as you, but I doubt I could even drive anything with that high Gain. Mine is down around the 30. What do you have the FFB set on the wheelbase?
     
  15. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Active Member

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    Thanks Vivian ;)

    This has helped nicely for my wheel too.
    Obviously not the same in game settings , but in file mods work well.
    Wheel feels more solid and life like .
     
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  16. Alegunner68

    Alegunner68 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    100ff 100 force I think, running the latest drivers, not beta.
     
  17. Rob Davies

    Rob Davies Bobby Dazzler

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    Hey DD1/2 users, I’m keen to give the latest Silver King another go... what wheel/in game settings do you recommend please? I hear you dial it in quite differently to default and I generally like med-heavy FFB.

    Many thanks in advance,
    Rob
     
  18. Marcin

    Marcin New Member

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    Hi Alegunner68 are you using the fanatec 381 RC driver with the latest motor firmware v22. I had to put FEI down to zero with your settings, not sure if that's right. Are you using High or Mid file? Glad you are back on the forum..
     
  19. 3StringCigar

    3StringCigar New Member

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    OK, I also have a CSW2.5 and I am finding these settings very good so far. I will drive for a few days to get used to them. I would be most grateful if you can expand on what "up a bit" was for your relax centre and Large Bump scale.
     
  20. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Active Member

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    I have found 1.0 relax values good in the past and did the same here. Gives me a fast moving centre. I think I went up to 5.0 on large bumps , can’t quite recall, but I think default was 3.0. went up a couple anyway.

    I have a different wheel though.
     
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