Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by kraM1t, Jun 15, 2020.
This guy sums up what I think it currently wrong with AMS2 compared to AMS1 and other sims.
Sorry but I hope Reiza doesnt change much with how slip is done.
You are obviously free to have an opinion but I think AMS2 has one of the best feeling of slip getting close and then controlling it. Custom FFB helps. AC was drift city, some insanely low speeds could make you lose grip...
And unless you show charts like Neils H. the video doesnt count
I respect your view and opinion and disagree, just bringing other users opinions to Reizas attention, as official forums tend to be a hotbed of fanboyism so the devs never have a different opinion portrayed to them.
Yeah i have to admit as well i do disagree with pretty much everything that is mentioned in the video. But like you said, we are all entitled to our opinions. Physics seems to be very subjective!
To me its good as it is especially how understeer and oversteer is managed.
As much as I like AC the way understeer occurs at low speed and losd of grip to that extent is just outrageous on quite few cars.
Didnt feel this at all in AMS2 even on FWD cars
My 2p of course
Have you checked other threads? There is plenty of suggestions and points to change/add/remove stuff. Some valid some less so.
This one isnt and from what you said it just seems you made the vid out of spite? (just not sure for what reason). So according to what you imply - the AC loss of grip/slip is done better even though its miles off reality compared to AMS2? (this is actually an objective observation - super cars shouldnt lose grip at 60kmh corner, my missus' old Focus corners better). I honestly hope AMS2 doesnt become just that.
It's not my video, and there are plenty of AC videos side by side with RL with almost exact cornering capabilities and speed, maybe it's your lack of driving ability?
Another thing I've noticed with AMS2 (and PCARS2) is the more you turn the wheel, the car actually rotates even more, but it should cause understeer. Possibly related to the physical SETA tyre model instead of the type used in AMS1/AC which is easier to manipulate certain scenarios without having it affect other stuff in the tyre, as Niels pointed out in his latest videos on why he prefers that type.
Lol nothing to add but... leaving a comment in here so I can get the notifications. This should go over interestingly
Im going to be commenting from using a T300 wheel.
It's pretty simple really, ffb should feel exciting to drive a car on it's limit.
it's the first sim i feel everything! Most sims do curbs, weight transfer, bumps you get the idea but this sim i feel the undulations, tire gripping under braking and loosing slip, road texture! i can adjust the tire pressure and feel the tires gripping i can change downforce and feel the wheel getting heavier and this on a T300! i can't go back to the assetto corsa or raceroom as they feel plain basic and boring and feel like so unrealistic now driving in VR after being spoilt by AMS2.
Maybe it's different with a DD wheel but on a T300 its awsome! i can't agree with that reviewer, i wonder if he tried nuscorpii custom ffb?
I think look up table physics simulations have had their day personally. The real time physics based sims might be more complex, and maybe not yet fully understood, but if you look at how flight sims have been transformed by using real time physics calculation it makes a very positive difference. It's going the same way for race sims in many cases.
Edit: Watched the video, 'If you want to hear an expert opinion stick around' said commentary Modesty is always a quality to be admired in my book.
How long are we giving this thread then guys?
I almost asked the same question. I'm thinking at least 5, up to 15
Where to start?
Firstly the guy seems to be talking about understeer, oversteer and slip windows as if they are set and don't respond to car setup. How can you spend 11 minutes 40 seconds criticising slip windows without talking about setup? Secondly he jumps into a sports prototype and finds it easier to drive because he's getting more resistance through the wheel. Has it not occured to him the massive downforce theses cars have which makes them heavier to drive? And then to talk about slip windows when he talks of 'throwing the car into a fast corner' as if the game should be compensating for his driving style is ludicrous. That is the fundamental difference between AC and AMS2, with AC you can get away with driving like a gorilla, with AMS2 it doesn't work because it doesn't work in real life.
I've think I've figured out why the cars are so unnatural when going from "slip to grip", and why it's so unrealistically easy to keep the car from spinning.
A much earlier post in another thread pointed out how the off-throttle oversteer in the Formula Vee could be alleviated by hitting the throttle hard, once the spin started. This is the opposite of AMS 1 and indeed reality, where hitting the throttle in a spin will worsen it.
All cars are doing this to some degree. That's the problem. Wheel spin should never self-correct like that. That's just common sense.
I stop watching in the second he says "AC is the golden standard" (about physics and ffb), my god, and he thinks its "an expert".
The real golden standard in fbb its rfactor 2, the opinion of someone that dont even notice that its irrelevant. Let them enjoy his "golden standar" pfff
The guy who made the video has actually driven race cars on track (your Fiesta or Civic around a local track doesn't count) which I'm gathering is more than a lot of people here have done who are giving their opinions as if they are the 'experts' no? Also I think the expert comment he made is a bit tongue n cheek so I wouldn't take it too seriously.
Here we gooooo!!!
Plus, hasn't AMS2 got a complex tyre model? AC/ACC certainly doesn't from recollection. Playing AC feels totally lifeless compared to AMS2. FFB is very stodgy and numb, the NuScorpii custom file (tweaked by shad) has for me completely transformed the game. I know this runs the risk of turning into a battle of the fanboys, but I can predict what the cars are going to do in AMS 2. It's intuitive, second nature. I get odd happenings and surprises jumping on AC. I don't have an axe to grind with AC, I was a fan back in the day. It's just in comparison it's crap, but that's my two cents (PT. ll)...
But he's not really comparing it to real life, he's comparing title to title.
Depending on several factors, RWD cars can actually understeer on throttle (I've experienced this quite often on central or rear engined cars) but always transitioning from stabilized cornering to acceleration.
If the car is already over rotating (provoked by inertia), any further action on gas should make things worse.
The opposite can happen for some reasons.
Too low load sensitivity, too low influence of lateral slip on longitudinal grip (or vice versa), too low relaxation length, too small dropoff of lateral grip curve after peak... or a combination of them.
I think Reiza has done a very good job in the previous months and apart from acceleration at (or above) the limit of adherence their cars are among the best in any sim.
In come cases it happens exactly the opposite (F-Trucks, Ultima Road), so I think there is margin for improvement in this specific aspect of throttle management that (at least for me) represents the most engaging part of driving.
Separate names with a comma.