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Automobilista 2 - June 2020 Review - SLIP AND GRIP?!

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by kraM1t, Jun 15, 2020.

  1. TekNeil

    TekNeil Take me back to the 2.4l, twin 50 weber days...

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    In cars with a heavily biased open diff. If an open diffed RWD car is 90deg sideways to the left (Extreme example), and you're pinning the throttle, the left rear wheel will be spinning (Unloaded) and scrabbling for grip. At these angles (In basic terms) this scrabbling for grip will be trying to put the car negative 90deg while the loaded tyre is simply scrubbing laterally and reacting to lash in the diff vs grip.

    But! I do agree with the points/ @SlowPoke80 The issue is the amount that this happens, the extremity of it is way over the top IMO, by a large amount. And especially so in anything where the diff is more locked under power.
    Edit: Just to add, that of course this is very car/setup dependant. Oh and I do believe that the devs are always improving things, I'm not worried at all because as it stands, it's still a damn good overall package/game/sim even at this stage.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2020
  2. John Hargreaves

    John Hargreaves Active Member Reiza Backer

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    What I got from watching the video through was 'some of the cars in this beta aren't quite there yet', so I'm glad that we have an expert opinion on the matter.
     
  3. kraM1t

    kraM1t New Member

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    He's comparing it to the title that comes the closest to real life at this moment in his opinion from actual real world experience unlike most here who base it on "what feels right to me"
     
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  4. Marius H

    Marius H Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    Guys, guys.. Lets it all sink in for a moment, and wait for a response from Renato, Heitor or Dom. <3 :D
     
  5. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    lol I disagree @Ivysaur - let's you and I sit back and let this thread devolve to the ugly place LOL

    - prepares popcorn -
     
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  6. TekNeil

    TekNeil Take me back to the 2.4l, twin 50 weber days...

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    At the end of the day...Horses for courses, choose your horse, enjoy your horse, be glad we have the choice of various horses.
    (I maybe need to stop with Red Dead Redemption).
     
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  7. kraM1t

    kraM1t New Member

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    I don't understand the hostility, don't we all want a better sim? I love AMS1 and want to love AMS2, I imagine any feedback is valuable to the devs whether useful or not. Why dismiss the opinion of somebody with real world experience just because you personally disagree with it? What if Lando Norris or Verstappen gave this info, would you suddenly 180 and say "Oh yeah I agree now actually"
     
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  8. SlowPoke80

    SlowPoke80 Member

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    Complexity does not equal realism. The iRacing tire model is a perfect example of that.
     
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  9. Aaron Green

    Aaron Green Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    In the least hostile way possible then, can I just ask as it keeps getting cited, what's your real life experience then? Just out of curiosity, I'm just interested to know.
     
  10. kraM1t

    kraM1t New Member

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    I never claimed to have any except karting, I said I found this video and the guy perfectly says what my opinion is currently on AMS2, it just so happens he has real experience.
     
  11. Aaron Green

    Aaron Green Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    No no that wasn't directed at you, I was lead to believe the guy was following this thread, I got the impression he commented earlier. By the by, what karting experience have you got? Always interested to see fellow karters on here, I've been racing rotax max, and other formulas growing up. Apparently within my discord channel, I'm what is known as a failure driver! Lovely.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2020
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  12. Madonion

    Madonion Member

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    i don't know about you, but if i find a car for instance the super V8 unsettled under braking i change the brake bias towards the front, if i find the formula trainers back slide out i stiffen the front anti roll bar. Isn't that what sim racing is all about? Must every car be perfect even in early access? We have seen reiza change physics on the downforce of the back wing of the formula 3 and we complained and they fixing it.
    Anyone tried setting world record in the game yet? if so does the car not feel great/better once you perfected the setup for it?
     
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  13. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    All I can say is this person did not have their FFB set-up correctly. I get amazing front-end and rear-end feel thorough my wheel. Every critique he detailed is wrong in that those forces are in the game and can be felt perfectly. Hence why there are so many glowing reports about the FFB and many people saying they cannot go back to playing AC after using AMS (1 or 2).

    Also, suggesting the AC is the gold standard diminishes the value of his opinions for me.

    Since he was clearly trying to drive without proper FFB, the only relatively useful comments relate to the tire slip issues at the beginning of the video--but even those may be coloured by the lack of proper FFB. A shame that a so-called expert would not be able to recognize this fundamental flaw in their own configuration.
     
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  14. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Maybe the content creator will make an account here and further clarify his comments.
     
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  15. Avoletta1977

    Avoletta1977 Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I tried to understand what you mean by reading twice (and then again) but no success...

    :oops:
     
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  16. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Someone should link this thread to his video, give the old boy a chance to defend himself hahah!
     
  17. Pete Baldwin

    Pete Baldwin Member

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    I guess he's not responding as you're trying to have a conversation rather than agreeing with him that AMS2 is terrible so I'll pick it up! I used to race TKMs for years - mainly at Rissington, Shennington, Whilton Mill etc. Where do you race?
     
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  18. Mahjik

    Mahjik Active Member

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    There is "scrubbing" behavior that happens. When a car understeers, it's going to scrub off speed (and generate heat). In that situation, it can (and likely will) scrub off enough speed to then re-grip and turn. There is a technique real racers use which is to enter a turn a little hot, scrub off some of the initial speed with the front tires and then settle into a corner. A lot of other sim engines don't have this scrubbing behavior which also allows some really strange low speed tank slappers happen which don't happen in real life.

    lol... I almost did the same thing. ;)



    I will say he's not the only one to bring up AC in this area. Kunos provided a lot of what's considered "fake forces" from a FFB purist perspective. You don't feel understeer in a real car. For a car that is not using electronic steering, there is a "little" lightness when understeering but not much. You do have to use other senses to understand understeer but Kunos did add a "fake effect" for it which AC users have come to rely on.

    The video author's other comment around the rear end feeling. When SMS was re-tooling the Madness engine, the WMD complained about this as well. This is why there was a property added called SoP (Seat of the Pants) to provide that rear feeling.

    So I'm not saying the video author is wrong for wanting these things, but he should acknowledge or understand what you get from a real car verses what are "added" FFB effects. Some purist don't want the "added" FFB effects but I do applaud Kunos for giving it as an option for those who do.
     
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  19. Madonion

    Madonion Member

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    How do you find the physics of the game?
     
  20. NuScorpii

    NuScorpii Well-Known Member

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    When you say real life experience do you mean the couple of experience days at Palmersport? Or is there more?
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2020

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