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Ease...anyone else?

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Cfst, May 19, 2020.

  1. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Glad I am not the only one seemingly convinced of stability when there shouldn't be.. thank you for your input (and ffb file contributions to the reiza forum).

    I also do not have buttons assigned, thinking that I would hate to press something by accident during a lap and not notice due to my vr headset.

    I will try cycling them on and off a few times more in the menu
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
  2. alink

    alink Active Member

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    Ah, good to know! That's new to me, hopefully this is an issue can be solved this way. Because I'm missing smoking tires and black roads:)
     
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  3. John Hargreaves

    John Hargreaves Active Member Reiza Backer

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    In PC2, the full speedo had the icons/indicators for TC/SC/ABS so you could always see what was active, but we only have the mini version thus far so there is no indication what's active or not. When you have an aid assigned to a button you get an on screen message that scrolls through such as ABS off/low/high but only if you have the hud active. If you drive without hud (I always do in VR) then no indicator.
    When I first set up the game after a profile delete, I usually start with full aids allowed, ABS low, SC off and TC low, then depending what car I drive I alter them to suit with buttons on my wheel, that way you can drive with authentic, but also test aids as well. First time in the Stock car I turned off ABS and TC, but it said both were n/a, so I thought I must have set it on authentic after all, but when I clicked the SC button, it toggled off, so it had been on, then I could toggle ABS and TC off. Might be a thing.
     
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  4. TekNeil

    TekNeil Take me back to the 2.4l, twin 50 weber days...

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    Interesting stuff here, I'd agree with fellow racers (Old, knackered, tired ex in my case lol) regards the levels of 'ease' on track VS a 'simulation'.

    I was struggling to understand where you were coming from at first OP, that was until Andy posted his videos which show very obvious issues (For some) as far as stability/grip levels, and then the 'Aids sticking on issue' was mentioned. Bingo. (Even with aids on there are issues there of course). I think the aids are certainly veering more towards 'Gamey' than realistic.

    So I think it's good that you guys have discovered the reasoning for some varying levels of 'difficulty' or 'realism'.
    I haven't noticed/had the issue of aids sticking on as yet myself which is why I couldn't grasp what you were referring to initially, and I can certainly be on the verge of, or lose the back end and spin when on the limit.

    I think there is an issue carried over from PC2 though, and that is with very slow speed spins, circa 30-40mph, it's something that happens only now and again, but the car will keep going around, sliding, spinning from 40mph all the way down to zero with little if any fall off until it stops.
    In reality at those speeds it should be a very quick speed fall off, with highly (Non linear) decreasing angles. The angles are the most obvious issue to me when it does happen (Rarely admittedly) because they are very linear with little decrease.

    I've literally had time to glance at the speedo and catch lower 30mph figures being shown as the car is still spinning and does so at a very linear rate. I think it's just a little physics calculation that needs tweaking. Most the time at those speeds, you shouldn't be '360 no-scoping' lol.

    Anyway, will have to venture more in to checking the car aids issue, see if I can replicate it.
     
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  5. SlowPoke80

    SlowPoke80 Member

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    It used to be that the cars were only unrealistically stable at moderate to high speeds; now they're unrealistically stable at all speeds. It's like driving Project Cars 2 or Forza.

    And what do I consider to be realistic? What the pros do.

    Nicki Thiim and others have said that the handling in PC 2 is arcade, and that iRacing is more difficult than the real thing. There has been lots of praise for AC, ACC, and to a lesser extent, AMS 1. They all have their weaknesses, but all are far superior to the very bad physics in AMS 2.

    I love AMS 1. I want AMS 2 to succeed as a sim. But it's way off at the moment.
     
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  6. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Interesting developments here. I will surely try to cycle on/off in the authenticity sub-menu and see if positive changes are present. @TekNeil shoot me a PM if you get a chance.

    @SlowPoke80 the positive thing is the dev team pushes out updates weekly and the simulation is yet incomplete. fingers crossed mate
     
  7. john Ellis

    john Ellis Member

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    Which is exactly why I went to the trouble of explicitly reframing the question in the manner that I did, as you had previously taken issue with others’ posts for failing to answer your specific question.
     
  8. Twinz

    Twinz New Member

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    I have not driven Forza, but I practiced for a trip to the Nurburgring using PC2 and PC2 absolutely nailed it. When someone who lives in Florida can practice for the Nurburgring, (a track he has never seen) in a sim and then fly across the globe, and drive in RL the way he did in the sim, I don't know how much more realistic it could be.

    This is what I want from a sim:


    I talked about this elsewhere, but without copy/pasting the long story, here's a short synopsis of what I experienced:

    "All the sketchy parts of the real-life Nordschleife matched the sketchy parts in PC2. Not just in where they were but how the ’86 responded to various inputs at those spots. It was uncanny. I wouldn’t recommend learning vehicle dynamics using only a sim, but the cause/effect relationship between the car, the track, and the driver’s inputs, is well simulated in PC2 with this combo."
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  9. SlowPoke80

    SlowPoke80 Member

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    You weren't really pushing your car to its limits -- you'd be stupid to risk it anyway. It's very easy for a sim to get below-the-edge physics right. Gran Turismo 1 on the PlayStation could do that. But once the edge is neared, everything falls apart.

    Now, if you'd won a few world championships, or at least driven hard enough to total a few cars, then I'd consider your opinion as informed. But you haven't, so I'll go by what the professionals say instead.
     
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  10. John Hargreaves

    John Hargreaves Active Member Reiza Backer

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    ooh, that's a bit harsh, it's still comparing things to real experience rather than just how other sims feel.
     
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  11. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    haha okay stay on topic.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2020
  12. Cliff

    Cliff Member

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    He tested the two worst cars in terms of simulated physics in PC2 and based his opinion around that.
     
  13. SlowPoke80

    SlowPoke80 Member

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    But the thing is he has no real experience at the edge. I've driven a car above the speed limit around corners, but not fast enough to have any risk of losing control. So the thing we have in common is we're not experts on extreme driving in cars. But the ones who are should be the ones listened to.

    Now I've driven (and over-driven) rental karts enough to spin and wreck in all kinds of ways. So when it comes to those things, I know what I'm talking about. And I can say that the rentals in AMS 1 are fairly accurate.
     
  14. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    To get things in the right direction again; I haven't yet tried to make this topic about true to life physics. :D

    **
    This thread, albeit poorly communicated by yours truly from the outset, is about cars represented in this sim title displaying stability when they shouldn't be.

    Thanks to @John Hargreaves and @NuScorpii providing some insight, I went back into AMS2 and did as advised. I drove in the sim, then went back to the gameplay section of the menu, and I cycled through the various driver aid options in the authenticity sub-menu a few times.

    When I fired up the same car and track combination, it sure seems there is validity to what these two users have mentioned!

    So while none of us can confirm...it seems likely that the SC, TC, and ABS were indeed STUCK ON, even though I forced them OFF since day 1 in my Menu settings. While I did not assign these functions to my keyboard or steering wheel in order to cycle them while on a lap as @John Hargreaves has done, I did follow @NuScorpii advice and cycled them through and re-saved my settings a few times.

    Big thanks to these guys for their insight. This was absolutely not in my imagination. I will say that I am still not satisfied with the FFB and some of the physics, however this bit of fiddling did absolutely seem to get rid of the driver aid/stability issues I have mentioned throughout this thread.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
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  15. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    Sorry but i've driven and still drive, and i'm not forced by media or licencing.
    It seems to me that you might have an issue with realistic grip levels, because i've played forza for many years and the grip in that game is non existent, wheelspin in all cars throughout the gears and absolutely no grip in any of the race cars, yeah it's arcade but it's supposed to be played with a pad.
    But to say AMS2 is bad, you need to either start driving in real life or get out on track, there isn't another game that represents anywhere even close in terms of ffb/tyre slip/load and feel apart from rfactor2.
    As for the assists issue, it could be down to having assists selected and not set to authentic after reading back on a few posts.
    Sorry but this guy is talking absolute nonsense and this isn't Pcars2 either.
    I know because that game was garbage and i played literally 2 mins, after all these so called pro/youtubers raved about it, where are they now, don't believe everything you hear from media and licencing, get out there and try it for yourself, if you don't like it then play something else, but don't blame the game.
     
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  16. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Interesting, as a fellow racing driver I respect this opinion. I am not sure I agree. Although, I realize this comment was not necessarily directed at me, I want to mention that while I may not think super highly of the current build, I realize that this is still early access!

    Thank you for the heads up! It seems like they were STUCK ON, despite my menu indicating they were off. After cycling through a few times through the various options as advised by @John Hargreaves and @NuScorpii , it appears the specific issues I was mentioning earlier have been corrected.


    Good to know my imagination is not running wild as some in this thread might have thought hahah. Thanks to those who offered advice on this topic instead of..well. everything else
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  17. Cliff

    Cliff Member

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    Wasn't exactly a scientific analysis by NT though was it? He didn't even change the tyre pressures after complaining about the grip.
     
  18. Cfst

    Cfst Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Reposting here to keep things on topic and hopefully close out the thread. I will tag @Renato Simioni so the dev team can see this and address this bug the two users seem to have found.

    ***This thread, albeit poorly communicated by yours truly from the outset, is about cars represented in this sim title displaying stability when they shouldn't be.

    Thanks to @John Hargreaves and @NuScorpii providing some insight, I went back into AMS2 and did as advised. I drove in the sim, then went back to the gameplay section of the menu, and I cycled through the various driver aid options in the authenticity sub-menu a few times.

    When I fired up the same car and track combination, it sure seems there is validity to what these two users have mentioned!

    So while none of us can confirm...it seems likely that the SC, TC, and ABS were indeed STUCK ON, even though I forced them OFF since day 1 in my Menu settings. While I did not assign these functions to my keyboard or steering wheel in order to cycle them while on a lap as @John Hargreaves has done, I did follow @NuScorpii advice and cycled them through and re-saved my settings a few times.

    Big thanks to these guys for their insight. This was absolutely not in my imagination. I will say that I am still not satisfied with the FFB and some of the physics, however this bit of fiddling did absolutely seem to get rid of the driver aid/stability issues I have mentioned throughout this thread.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
  19. Matías Corvino

    Matías Corvino New Member

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    Wow! That little assists on-off trick has made wonders to the game. Previously, I couldn't feel barely any weight transition, specially with older cars where it should be more pronounced. After that, cars like F-Vintage and old Opala work fantastic, considerably closer to the AMS1 level, without losing the good bits of AMS2. Thank you guys
     
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  20. hereforthat51

    hereforthat51 Member Reiza Backer

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    RF2 older cars like FISI 2012 has an "exploit" in the tire pressures.
    Doing alien times was a matter of dropping the pressures to min on some simple tracks like Interlagos and Silverstone.
    In AMS2 we were doing the same with the hard tires thing.
     

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