Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Cfst, May 19, 2020.
Alex Albon said on twitch AC F1 cars slip angles were weird here.
Mods feel free to close this thread so it doesn't run astray, as it has a bit a few times. I will tag the devs in relevant post above so they see the bug two users highlighted.
Hi, may be you can post this problem in the bugs thread too in order to not being buried in this discussion.
-And also inaccurate. If he had taken the time to look around the YT channel he would know that I have a lot of experience driving at the limit. (and over it, unfortunately)
Anyway, back to his claim...
When I first started competing, I was overdriving a lot, and I actually thought it was fast.
Then, I started learning to tame my overdriving tendencies and got a good bit quicker. It doesn't *look* as fast to the casual observer. Some might even say it's "nowhere near the edge", but when I get it right, it looks slow and uneventful, yet it's actually right on the edge.
And more recent slow-looking driving in a real 86:
I drive lots of cars "on the edge" and I do so very often. (well, at least before the planet got shut down I did.) I still do "fast-looking" stuff on the track from time to time, it's just now I know it's usually *mistakes*.
Now, about his perception of the Ring video I posted. All audio is from the RL run, no audio from PC2 in that vid. So at the very beginning, the tires you hear quietly protesting are the real tires on the edge of traction. :27, :29 same. At 1:01, that little tail wag is just a little over the edge and cost time. (a mistake) From 1:14 to 1:17 the tires are on the edge of traction as it tracked-out to the far rumble strip. 1:21...2:49...3:26...3:33...3:45...3:54...4:02...4:09...4:15...4:24...4:40.....
Now, tire squeal is just a hint though. Different compounds protest at different points. Some start crying wolf way early and others sound, and feel, planted right up to the moment they snap out from under you. However, I was there and I know how close to the edge I was and how often. I wasn't going for a Bridge to Gantry record and pushing 100% in every turn (that insurance deductible), but I was in a hurry out there. The change in tire sound with the tail wag is a decent reference though. The difference is minimal when the tail actually wags and gives you an idea of how close the other times were.
I don't claim to know how a Formula car is supposed to handle at the limit, but I have driven a lot of cars at the limit over the years and I have particular experience of how the 86 handles at the limit. I own two, compete in one, and the number of other 86's I have driven at various competitions has to be well into double digits by now. I know what the car is supposed to feel like at the edge.
I'm glad this bug has been found. I'm sure they will fix it, and I will now know to check for it if things feel wired.
Most of the time I have stability control on (in real street cars) they don't want to turn.(understeer....lots of understeer...and throttle can be unresponsive in some systems) Is this what you meant when you said "stable"?
I had a race with the MCR 2000 at Jerez and from pole I managed to smoke up the rear tyres off the start and lose positions, no idea what I had at the time with regards to SC and TC. Seems like there are a few different experiences going on.
thank you guys, that was the best thread!
There's really a bug. If assistance are set to OFF, then they are ON, either on low or high (ABS, TC SC). Also if you switch ON/OFF steering, braking help, then assistance remain on although the help is turned OFF.
My experience is that the assistance should be set on ON to set each single to OFF. That seems to work.
Now, I can lock up my brakes! I also get wheel spin! Great!
If it's realistic enough or not difficult to say but it's much better.
By the way, if you hitting a wet spot you are sliding
Glad to hear. Myself and another member have reported this bug on the official thread. As of yet, since a build is probably coming public today or tmrw, I don't think this will be replicated and addressed on their side in time but maybe on the next one?
Off setting Greys out a few items...one would think this should work but here we are
grey isn't equal to OFF it only means you can't change it.... and OFF does not mean that everything is OFF, only you can't toggle it anymore....today I learned something new
It is quite easy to understand if traction control is on or off.
Set the HUD in telemetry mode and look at the throttle green bar.
If it goes down by itself when you are at full throttle, then traction control is ON.
lol thanks mate, this did not occur to me honestly but this is indeed a very easy way. Thank you
also assigning those assists to button on the wheel and toggling through them mid lap works too as John Hargreaves mentioned, as once one adjusts from the assigned buttons, confirmations show up on screen
I concede you have a lot of experience driving over the edge in autocross, which is done at slow speeds for a few minutes at a time. But this game is focused on high-speed circuit racing.
I did the menu thing where you toggle the aids off, and watched my throttle in the HUD. The cars became a little bit unstable at low speed again, and the TC clearly wasn't activating. Still just as arcadey at high speed, though.
AC is known to have a little trouble with tightly-sprung cars; that's one of the weaknesses to which I was referring. It's also bad with high curbs. But it's excellent on relatively even surfaces with moderately-sprung cars.
Personally very happy AMS seems to have moved from the hard = realistic approach. I thought many of the cars in AMS1 were too hard to drive (still had lots of fun with it though ). AMS2 so far feels much more on the money - that being certain stupid acts will cause a complete loss of control but otherwise what I do just increases or decreases my lap times and I rarely go off track until I'm really pushing the limits and deserve to.
I find the micro adjustments I can make to the car mid corner to be sublime, both in what the FFB tells me and the ability to adjust the car using the throttle is the best I've ever felt - like I've got a whole new dimension of feedback and input for the car. When something bad happens I know it's my fault and I know why it happened. That's exactly what you want - not "oh no I've spun again didn't expect that" which indicates a disjoint between what you know from reality and what the game thinks should happen. Unless of course you've gotten so used to overly difficult to drive cars you think that's normal? IMO that's the crux of the issue here.
I really really hope the hard = realistic crowd don't win any important discussions on this front for what so far (MP aside atm) is looking like the best driving sim I've ever played. A car should be easy to drive but hard to master. Not hard to drive and almost impossible to master.
I've driven a few cars hard on a track and the road and the only time I ever lost it was a FWD Seat Leon when I misjudged the next corner badly and had to brake way too hard while turning in to stay on the road, instant snap oversteer however even me at the time - untrained driver driving like an idiot - I still easily corrected it to straighten the car and drive on - (though a little poo might have come out ). This was on a small B road.
Have they got all the cars right yet - of course not but I know a real car should only be unsavable regularly if it's really badly designed or you drive like a complete moron. All cars I've driven so far felt in the right zone for difficulty.
Oh and a race around VIR in the Super V8's the other night was unbelievably exciting and deffo didn't feel easy in any way. The car felt like I'd expect - beastly and dangerous and took huge concentration to get around the track fast as it felt ready to kill me any any moment the way VIR is like the rollercoaster of race tracks. If it was made harder to drive it would be silly and frankly not enjoyable.
Lol Jesus, do people read the whole thread before posting? I was trying to describe a specific issue which has been addressed, and it was in reference to a bug I was experiencing.
I was not trying to say that hard/easy = realistic, apologies if it came across that way. I was trying to indicate, as clarified in various posts, that it seemed the cars displayed stability when loss of control absolutely should have been experienced. Thanks to a few people we have chalked it up to a menu/setting bug which seems to cause driver aids to default to ON, when indicating/set to otherwise in the menu.
Mods, feel free to close the thread as the community has sorted this bug out and posted it to the appropriate thread. Apologies for anything which was misconstrued or poorly communicated in my original post, but I clarified in later posts and the issue seems sorted out. This thread just keeps going astray and burying the solution in the process, which could be useful to others as we have seen in earlier posts.
Yet you list wrecking rental carts on your driving-dynamics resume'?
Although I disagree that actually wrecking a vehicle is a requirement for learning/understanding "where the edge is", I didn't say anything about it...didn't even care how fast you were going when you wrecked the carts. The edge is the edge.
I know how real 86's feel at the limit. If it makes you feel better, just assume that I only verified PC2's accuracy with the 86/Ring combo for all the turns under 130kmh (there are a lot of those) and I was just making wild guesses for the turns over that velocity.
I would consider copy/pasting the TC/SC bug-issue/fix in the OP.
will do bro!
No, no they don't. As it's 4 pages and I picked out what I thought was the main argument in scanning those 4 pages.
And it was an issue I had a strong opinion on - sorry old chap.
Oh and maybe saying this in your opening post set the tone
"I am sure I will get flamed for this, but I am genuinely curious: Does anyone else find the cars extremely easy / way too easy to drive, even with all of the assists off since maybe .8.2?
It might just be in my head. But if it isn't.. ? what gives! is this a game or a simulator!"
yes, but I clarified so many times throughout the thread..
Even so, the opening post seemed to trigger people but the fact remains; with all the driver aids set to full without one knowing (while it indicates OFF in the menu, might I add), I think the opening post is appropriate
Separate names with a comma.