Headmovement & camera shenigans

Looks like I owe some of you guys an apology!

Turns out when I triple checked my stuff that my camera settings must have been messed up since a while back.

I had legacy camera to OFF and head movement to 100. With legacy ON and head movement to 0 it literally transformed the game... Now the front is aligned all the way and I don't get that weird rotation effect. (Is sure damn bumpy on formula cars but I can live with that lol)

No wonder I got that weird rotation.. that head movement shouldn't even be in the game.

It suddenly feels immensely better.

And thanks @GFoyle for the "rFuktor2 Karsten Hvidberg - Eddie de Beer & Friends Tribute" ffb file, I think it might be a step up for me compared to the "Rack force". Feel the tyre load up a bit better I believe!

Thanks guys!!

 

Give yourself a little natural eye adjustment buffer to bumps by allowing 5-10 main head movement .

 

Yeah he is good at communicating and putting feelings into words.

But it's just so clear that he will end up disappointed in any sim that does not feel exactly like Assetto Corsa. He can't even stand the new AC EVO which I feel represent road cars in an absolute amazing way. I love AC too but its really starting to show its age even with mods, the AI is just very bad compared to AMS 2 for example.

So head movement set to around 5-10 to filter out the worse shakiness? What exactly does head movement do? I tried to read up but can't really find a good source on it.

I think it's very clear with 100 head movement and legacy OFF that the whole camera lags behind the movement of the car and makes it feel like the car is rotating on entry while its oboesolo is just an camera effect.


Thanks!

 

Its really a mix of neck and eye movement. This is my take and not to be confused with anything official that might be documented somewhere.

it’s quite hard to explain without sounding a bit weird.

Legacy OFF seems to me to be fixing your head and eyes into a focal point past the windscreen and allowing your torso including everything attached to it including the interior to move from below the neck ( semi disconnected ) , so this gives the impression that the dashboard is bouncing and pivoting in your near view depending on the setting value as the value is how much your allowing the focal point to change, everything around you is moving more than your eyes

Legacy ON seems to be the opposite, so fixing your neck to your body and everything in front of the windscreen to your eyes that are fixed in a stable position depending on how low you set it ( with everything on zero it’s akin to wearing a neck brace ) so things that are changing axis past the windscreen ( your view ) will appear to move up and down , left and right etc etc . .
But at low or zero setting you limiting the amount your allowing that view past the windscreen to move .

So in relation to how we view the world IRL which unlike most modest sim rig applications, the car including the windscreen is moving constantly and our eyes and neck are adjusting in a small amount without any conscious effort, stabilising the view .

so for me, legacy ON with a small amount of movement allowed, but with any of those side to side movements still limited to next to nothing , mimics this natural eye and neck stabilisation without allowing the neck to twist .

: this has really derailed the thread , and Marius is going to tell me off I’m sure .

 

The only reason to use Legacy Head Movement is if you are one of those drivers who like a "bolted to car" camera. I know there's a bunch of people out there who drive like that. For me it makes the world into a shaky/blurry mess, especially on bumpy tracks like Sebring!

If you like a dampened camera like most modern sims these days the standard "non-legacy" camera is great. To me it feels almost exactly like the default iRacing camera which I think has a good balance of dampening and stability. I runt the "Head Movement" slider at 0 since it only seems to affect how quickly the camera aligns to pitch/roll.

Just be careful with the G-force settings! Lateral G-force (side-to-side) is makes the car feel super floaty, I run it at 0. Vertical (up-down) is not bad, but you already have pretty good filtering of bumps so I don't find it necessary. Longitudinal (forward/backwards) actually gives a pretty cool effect. The camera will move slightly backward/forward on acceleration/braking and makes shifting feel "punchy". I run it at 50.

 

Actually, these G-force settings are only necessary—and truly immersive—if you have a motion system. In that case, they should be synchronized as precisely as possible.

 

I keep "legacy head movement" on and head movement at 30. This way, the road doesn't look shaky, and the dashboard barely moves.

 

Great replies. Legacy ON for sure feels like it’s bolted on the car. I do like how in turns you can regulate your driving easier since you can adjust to the bumping of the track.

But yeah the shaking is horrible.

What i love about the legacy OFF is the smoothness, but i cant tell if it introduces that weird pivot effect or if its isolated to the head movement option. Not sure if its placebo but it feels like there is some pivoting effect in there.

 

I don't think it adds any pivoting. It only feels weird to me if I turn on the Lateral G-forces.

To me it looks very similar to what you get in iRacing by default, something like this:

Lots of filtering of bumps, and you can see the chassis move independently from the camera. But no weird rotation or "springiness".

I've tried using Legacy Head Movement without locking the camera completely (ie setting Head Movement higher than 0) but I think that is basically just "lock to horizon", no filtering of bumps.

 

With legacy OFF and 100 head movement i notice a huge difference compared to having it 0. For me it looks like the whole car has a huge slip angle and turns from the center, its god awful for me.

 

Yup, the Head Movement slider seems to just affect yaw/pitch. It has no effect on the damping/filtering of bumps. Legacy Off and Head Movement at 0, feels great and very similar to iRacings default camera.

 

I can't drive well with those settings; I see strange movements that confuse me. I also play iRacing, and for me, it feels more realistic with Legacy ON and head movement set to 20/30.

 

Made a quick video of a couple of laps:

That is with Legacy: Off and Head Movement: 0. Feels predictable and smooth to me, no swaying or pivoting, just filtering of bumps. Extremely similar to the iRacing clip above.

Tried some laps with Legacy: On as well. With Head Movement at 0 or a low number the world is really shaky, very uncomfortable. Higher Head Movement just adds more lock to horizon which feels strange to me. Any time you go up/down a hill the whole cockpit tilts around you.

 

It might be a personal preference; the way it looks in the first video bothers me, whereas I find that "Legacy" mode combined with a head movement setting of 30 strikes the perfect balance. Ah... I use a triple-monitor setup; maybe that makes a difference.

 

I think what still bothers me is how you see the cockpit inside sway during corners, it always tricks me into there is some slip angle where there is not. You would not get that with Legacy ON, but yes the shaking is really bad there is no denying that. Both modes work good though as long as head movement is 0 or very little.

Personally I want the cockpit/chassi of the car extremely bolted because it makes it so much easier to see the actual yaw/slip angle of the car once you are on the limit.

Thanks for the discussions!

 

FYI
Simple Camera comparison with Legacy Head Movement

 

I also use legacy movement (combined with a low value for head movement) since forever. It was the default when the sim initially released in 2020 and was quickly changed as people complained it made them "uncomfortable" and that it was different from other sims.
I hate the default being a "bobbing" cockpit with dead stable horizon: it looks very unnatural to me and lack the perceived "dynamism" of the legacy mode.

 

With "legacy on," the more you increase head movement, the less the track vibrates (dashboard movement increases). For me, this is ideal once you find the sweet spot; I’d recommend starting with a value of 30 and going no higher than 45.

 

It’s the same for me; the swaying dashboard and static horizon bother me. Unlike in real life, where you actually move, in the simulator you remain stationary (unless you have a motion rig), so I find it much more realistic—and less disorienting—to have a mostly steady dashboard and a horizon that bounces a bit.

 

I used to have legacy fixed, but found I missed things like elevation changes or quick direction changes.

So now I've settled on legacy off (and all the look to apex stuff off), but with sliders on 15 for head movement, plus the 3 g-force settings. It gives a small amount of movement but not enough that I notice it much or find it distracting.