Official General AI Comments & Discussion Topic

Car / Track: VW TS Cup. Monza Junior.
AI Strength: 103.
AI Aggression: Max.
Session Distance: 28 laps.
Weather: Real weather 14/2/2018. Race start at 17:00. Clear sky, temperatures around +6 C - +10 C.
Session: Race.
Other settings: Tyre wear and fuel use not accelerated. Mandatory pits enabled.
Report: The AI lost due to pit strategy. I was pretty steadily P7/8 (qualified P6) until the pit cycle started. When the cycle finished I was P1 and ended up winning by 15 seconds.

The AI was sitting in the pits for 25 seconds while I got away with approximately 8 seconds. I think they took tyres when there was not even a remote need for it on my part.

I do not have a screenshot of my tyre widget or saved telemetry, but I probably used about 10-15 % of the green tyre area on the worst tyre shown on the widget.

 

Car / Track: Lotus 98 @ Buenos Aires No.8 (because it is an awesome config)
AI Strength: 103
AI Aggression: medium
Session Distance: 35 laps
Weather: medium cloud to random
Session: every session




Confiteria: AI still has a weird line, slows down quite a lot in the second part of the corner.
You can gain an unrealistic amount of time here.

Section after Confiteria to Curvon No.8: The AI is still hesitant/slow here, especially in the left/right combination, I can sometimes even overtake on the outside here.

Curvon No.8: AI is slow in the first part until the middle part of the corner.

All issues can be seen in my video.

 

Car / Track: DPI Cadillac @ Monza Historic 1971
AI Strength: 100
AI Aggression: medium
Session Distance: any distance
Session: Race
Report:
AI cars are bunched up and drive like that all the race. Of course, this is not only a problem with Monza Historic 1971 but it happens on all tracks, but in Monza 1971 it just goes beyond all reasonable limits. AI not only huddle together, they drive 2-4 cars parallel to each other and occupy the entire width of the track. But that's not all, when they're in front of you they slow down and block you and you just haven't enough room to overtake them and you have to brake hard and then the AI behind you attack you like crazy. Also, like I said, when you're behind AI it slows down, but when you manage to overtake it and it gets behind you, then all of a sudden it speeds up and tries to attack on you.
To sum up, it was a terrible racing experience, I restarted the race many times and each time the race turned into a mess and the top 10 AI finished in a packed tight group within 1.5 seconds.
You can see how it looks like on this image:
Automobilista-2-Screenshot hosted at ImgBB

 

What said Tornado makes me think of AMS1 AI, they also used to get hangry if you pass them and they attack you alltought they was slower before. Wierd because the AI in AMS2 comes from Pcars.

 

That's pretty bad and hilarious at the same time .

That's the main issue that's holding the game AI from being great. They seem to have this magnetism when evenly matched, plus their inability to outbrake on the inside is the big piece of the puzzle to make the game AI great, let's keep hoping they manage to solve it!

 

Car / Track: F-Vintage@ Nürburgring 1971
AI Strength: 110
AI Aggression: Max
Session Distance: any distance
Session: Any
Report
The AI lines are all over the place and they keep crashing all over, If it's a 3 car battle the car at the end of the queue goes bonkers and slides all over like if he had a seizure. Also they overtake by bashing each other which causes crashes as well. Not many cars end up finishing because of this issue.

 

While testing races against AI with very low reliability values, I saw that cars with blown engine do not leave the track quite soon, but keep on going for a long time and then very often stand still on the middle of the track and cause accidents before getting teleported to pits and retire.

1. Would be nice if cars with broken engine would leave the track a bit earlier.

2. Instead of getting teleported to pits, it would be a nice feature if those cars would park beside the track until the race ends, like it was in the old days.
But I have no idea whether this is possible with the Madness engine.

 

Unsurprisingly, not much has changed since my extended break from AMS2. The AI are still very much robotic in terms of motion, they still unnecessarily weave, they twitch, and they have very little intelligence with regards to track positioning and overtaking.

It is very difficult to get accustom to this when you've come from iRacing and RF2 AI... This thread just seems like a complete waste of time as well. I never see any sort of engagement from the devs and aside from small improvements over the years, I feel like not much has changed.

The AI desperately need a physics overhaul and some logic updates. Using the Ai from the madness engine and trying to improve it was always going to be a mistake in my eyes, they're just so fundamentally broken. It reminds me of ACC...

I want to be able to invest into this game and buy DLC but I literally have no reason to because of how fundamentally flawed the offline aspect of the game is. I suspect this is never going to change either, and it is a huge error. Multiplayer has limited numbers as it is.

 

Well there's supposed to be improvements for the AI in the 1.5 update, I just hope they manage to fix the pack racing and improve their ability to overtake, those are the 2 fundamental faults with the AI right now.

The hesitation faster cars have to overtake is what makes them erratic behind trying to "find" a way past, and the pack racing just exagerates that issue with many cars trying to "find" the way past, but then just backing off.

If they manage to fix those issues (along with some dubious lines they have on some tracks when again, behind others) the AI would be great, I have no issue with racing them side by side, they leave me space and very seldom run me off track, love how they make the mistakes and suffer mechanicals failures. Of all the modern racing "sims" only the F1 games does the same dynamic races.

So IMHO if they fix those 2 fundamental issues and then fine tune the AI pit strategies and smaller stuff, the game would be pretty much as good as it gets for offline racing.

 

I am open to see what the improvements are like but realistically, no amount of refinement will fix the AI fluidity when driving. This is due to the oversimplified physics model that they have. Until we see changes in this department, I just cannot see how they will behave any differently.

Having said that, I am open to be corrected and will try out V1.5 when it is made available.

 

I don't think the main issues are due to the AI being on different physics, PC2 doesn't have the pack racing issue and are better at overtaking each other. I think it's more of a coding issue, they are much better at racing the player compared to PC2, but worse at racing each other.

 

well..it's surprisingly that you mentioned these games...as iRacing is fully online-oriented game and has no any proper offline mode. and rF2?? rF2 has some serious fundamental issues with offline modes and AI... I can't imagine how we can tell that rF2 AI is good. As for my opinion AMS2 AI and offline experience overall is much better than rF2

 

I am not really sure how to respond to this, are you intentionally trolling? iRacing Ai is the most advanced of any sim right now, it uses machine learning. It also has a fully customisable championship mode, a talent editor, and it even gives reports at the end of races. If this is your opinion of iRacing, then I have no idea what to do tell you about Rf2. You're clearly not very good at observation.

This is an embarrassing ill-informed comment to make.

 

well...I didn't play iRacing for very long time..so I did't know about iRacing devs did AI and offline modes. My fault. But as for rF2 I spent hundreds hours to play it and I know what I'm talking about

 

Have you tried rF2 in the last 12 months? Because if you haven't, I would advise that you do. It has received substantial improvements to all areas of the offline experience. Prior to this, no changes had been made since as early as 2016.

I am not sure how you can say that rF2 is not very good, though. It is well established in the sim racing community that it has the second leading in terms of AI, and with the recent changes, its nearly a contender for 1st place.

 

I have played rF2 yesterday ))) of course rF2 is very good for physics model and driving but in matter of offline experinece and racing with AI it's surely not very good. It has no career mode, no championshop mode, no custom championship mode, no talent editor for AI drivers... you have to spend hours to sort out AI drivers and other things and make it playable. And still AI drivers make some stupid things like crashing, hitting walls, cutting corners, spinning out on many workshop circuits, but even on devs tracks AI is often over-aggressive with player car, divebombing, don't keep proper distance to player car when having side-by-side close racing and other issues with AI behaviour... rF2 is good mainly for hotlapping and for some practice with AI but as for full-fledged offline mode and proper racing with AI it's surely not good enough yet

 

It does have a championship mode, you can use the rF2 Log Analyser for this. It is brilliant and does a better job than most games to be honest. It even has the functionality for live timing, AI tyre wear, AI fuel usage, top speed, and details pit stops, etc if you like viewing that kind of stuff on a second display.

The talent editor was in the game at one stage, yes, but they removed it. Not sure why but it still possible to do it via a notepad. It makes for great racing as you can create your own grid, liveries, names, skill, etc.

Everything you have outlined about the AI is completely the opposite to what I experience. For me, they have some of the best race craft and awareness, they have great motion, and they're exceptionally good at navigating through slower traffic. I have done extensive testing with LMP1 and GT3 (probably the most extreme that you can get in terms of speeds), and I was consistently seeing the LMP1 battling against its competitors through slower traffic and after 20 laps, the gap was still only 3 seconds.

I would urge you to try the upcoming update. I am beta testing it now and I can assure you, it is a game changer All of the stability issues that you have outlined are a thing in the past.

 

thanks for info.. of course I will race rF2. I like it despite all issues. But I play mostly workshop third-party content (cars and tracks). Maybe it's a reason why I experienced so many issues with AI

 

F-Retro G1
Nürburgring Nordschleife 1971
1.4.8.0

AI far too slow on the straights, just watch:

(seems like my mic was still on for this. Ah well...)

 

Formula gen 2
Barcelona GP
1.4.8.0

Just did an 18 laps at barcelona x4 tyre wear, AI was able to finish on soft tyres without pitting while I destroyed my medium tyres at 6 laps and have to pit.