Official Time Trial Report Topic

In TT, no matter the actual settings in the game options, "Authentic Assists" is enforced, so the vast majority of time trial tables consist of "no assists" for all entries.

For cars that do have assists authentically, then those are allowed. For example in time trial with GT3 cars, people may be using TC and ABS (but not SC), but currently we can not tell which entry uses what. I am sure that when a web interface to the leaderboards is implemented, this info will also be available, like it is in PCARS2 (hover the mouse over the last column under "assists" here Red Bull Ring GP - Ferrari 488 GT3)

The above is true for the standard assists, TC, ABS and SC. There are other assists like steering/brake assists etc which are debatable if they can make you faster or not, but those are always allowed, no matter the car.

 

But isnt there a contradiction here?
If as you say "Authentic Assists" is enforced in TT then in your last sentence they are only "allowed".
Personally it doesnt really matter because I usually is pretty competitive without any aids activated - but since the posts above Im beginning to wonder if I could be even more competitive if we all was enforced to run in the same way
At least for me it sounds a bit more fair

ByTheWay: Good old NR2003 and as example its famous GTP mod had a Hard Core mode where no aids was allowed and cockpit view was mandatory. No possibility of "cheating" here

 

Well i'm no alien but I turn all assists off no matter the car so I lock and spin the rears but I don't think that is conveyed on a ghost lap. The main reason is that the assists made driving feel artificial when I tried then on an earlier build and felt like they got in the way of driving. Also I prefer driving the older cars, or ones which have a lot of slip angle and countersteer i.e. vintage, Caterham 620R, etc. and TC would ruin driving them.

Do the assists make you quicker on/off? No idea, but even if they were faster I doubt I would enable them (even on GT3's) as with aids off you can play with them a little - well as much as they allow.

 

I used to think NO.
At least conserning TC and and I dont know if the other is called Stability Control (where the throttle is automatically lowered when the car begins to slide).
They both lower the throttle and therefore does lower the cars power/HP - so...
My own conclusion is that if you can control the same things (throttle) manually then you can decide yourself how much "power" you want to waste at certain places on a track.

 

Indeed, by "assists" on my mind I only have the standard ones, TC, ABS and SC, which as I said for more cars are disallowed in TT anyway. But then I remembered about the other assists like steering assist etc, which unfortunately it is not possible to disable in the current state of the madness engine in neither time trial or multiplayer.

Also TC and SC indeed slow you down if you do not need them, but for people that need them, they are helpful and make them faster and I see no reason disabling them for cars that really have them IRL, it's realism we are after, aren't we? What I would really like to see in the future, is Reiza to spend some time reworking how TC works in the madness engine, to make it work more realistically so it actually does become helpful also to the faster drivers, like it is in real life.

 

Is this confirmed as so.?
I have everything off in all possible settings and have no sense of steering assist thankfully!
TT or otherwise.
I assume as my settings are all off that when I run TT even in a car with tc/abs that my "off settings apply. maybe @Renato Simioni or @Domagoj Lovric can confirm pls.
In TT if the cars that have them in default ie setting of 20, If I have to set them off fully ie 100
then my time will not be as a default setup?

(they feel off but steering? feels off but need confirm from dev) ref above post

I have no interest in any assists of any type in any car and when I set them off in all preferences I expect they are off.
This includes online multiplayer when I set sessions as off I expect players to have no assists also and be unable to use them. Ive had differing reports when asked fellow drivers online if they work.?
For wet online its crucial to have all off for all participants. For the sessions I run.

 

Yeah I would also very much se this confirmed.
Or rather confirmed that this kind of mandatory aids is not a fact.

OK I can agree on that.
And I admit also that in Racerooms TT competitions then there is a mode called something with "realism" where you in some cars are allowed to use as example TC - because the cars use it in RL .
And eventhough Im principally against it then some of the formula cars are so high powered that a tiny touch of TC at least made the cars more easy to drive - for @meToo.

 

This is how it works in the Madness engine in PCARS2, so I am pretty sure it's the exact same thing in AMS2 (and my experience so far confirms it):

Regarding TC/SC/ABS:

If you have them all disabled in the options, then for you there are indeed always disabled in any mode, end of story. In TT, those will be logged as "no TC, no SC, no ABS used", although this info is not currently visible anywhere (I am sure it will be visible when we get a web interface). Only thing we can see in the leaderboards right now, is if the setup used was default or not. If you make any change to the setup at all, including the % TC setting (which has no impact at all, if you have TC disabled in the settings), then your TT entry will be considered as using custom setup

If you have TC/SC/ABS set to Authentic or Enabled, then it depends on the actual car you are driving in TT, if you are really using them. If the car (like the Mini JCW) does not have TC in real life, then no matter your settings, in TT you will be always driving it with TC off. If the car does have TC, like the GT3 cars, then it depends on your settings if it will be actually enabled or not. And you can use a key binding or the ICM to enable/disable it on the fly while driving, something you cannot do for the Mini.

For multiplayer, it depends on the lobby settings. If those 3 assists are disabled, then nobody can use them. If they are enabled, then everybody can optionally use them (via their settings or on the fly), but never such an assist is enforced.

Regarding the other assists, like Steering Assist:

For those you have total control for you and only you. If you have then disabled they will always be disabled for you. But everybody else can do whatever they want with them, in both TT and multiplayer they can have them enabled or disabled at will and there is no way to prevent this.

Question is if it really makes a difference...Personally, I tried it a few times, but really could not tell the difference. Other people were complaining that there is an advantage for some when they used it and asked the developers to offer the possibility to disallow them in multiplayer, but that never happened (like so many other things requested for PCARS2...). I know a few people do use it, but I think most don't. At least in Time Trial, in the web interface for PCARS2 we can see who uses it and who not, and the vast majority (including usually the record holders) do not. But it's a subject still open for debate..

 

In MP, when Aids are banned, players can not activate them by binded keys.
But if they switch to options/gameplay, they can activate aids there and will have them on track.

Edit: Found it out by coincidence. Set up a lobby for racing with a friend some months ago. He is new to sim racing and drives with abs and auto gears. Forgot to allow aids in settings, apologised, but he was like "no problem, my aids are working".

 

Silverstone 2001
GT1
Starting of TT between Luffield (the long right hander) and Woodcote, missing speed when crossing s/f line (means about 0.3 seconds). Better would be just before entering Luffield to build up all the speed till s/f.

 

Yes, so an improvement option, at some point.

So as suspected ? in multi.
Will continue the Question in Multiplayer thread.

Back to TT specific Reports

 

Reiza, I look at it from a simple point of view. First, I'm no alien. My wheel, throttle and brakes are planted firmly on the earth with the rest of us mere mortals. Second, I'm far from a setup expert. Call me Mr. Default if you must. Third, I'm a simple guy with decent equipment who loves to turn laps in his sim.

Some practice laps and some AI racing. In AMS2 when I'm racing or turning practice laps it's total enjoyment. 11am and Sunny on the track is where I live. Rain? Who needs it, rains plenty where I'm from and I get sick of it but that's just me.

Then... the big event. Move over to TT and see how I stack up against the track records... so called. Then the #$@% show begins. Driving is totally different, handling is different, everything is different. No more fun, just an icy spin fest to try an catch guys that are 10 seconds a lap faster even though your own lap times are generally respectable in practice or races.

I finally had to come to the conclusion that it's no more TT for me. It's not fun, cars handle terrible (I guess maybe it's the track) and no one is ever going to catch these people tuning "unreal" lap times at the top so what's the point?

How about ditching the TT and spend the precious dev time and $'s improving the rest of the sim, adding cars, default setups, tracks, AI, etc. Make a tick box in practice mode so you can time the first lap and start on the track instead of the pits.

 

@Darrel Klassen
The first advice to you could be to not load ghosts of people 10 sec faster than yourself.
My personal experience conserning TT is that on the first many(!) sessions on a track I only load my own fastest session ghost.
Thats much more fun.
Because then you can compete with yourself - and as example with a big grin on your face exactly see when the dude holding your until now fastest session lap made one of his several goofy mistakes.
Because in the beginning this dude sucks

ByTheWay: I consider this a pretty good advice to both get faster - but also by any means have a lot more fun driving in this basically single player mode.

 

I've done that but my main point is TT at least for me is nothing but frustration. Cars / tracks handle terrible. It's nothing but a spin fest companied to practice or racing. No fun at all.

 

Which cars/tracks feel like that to you? They can't be all! There does exist an important difference to practice, in TT you run with only 5 litres of fuel and that makes a big enough difference in some cars' handling (there are a few that I also do not like driving them in TT), but most of them are fine I think.

 

Hard to say I guess, for me it seems like all of them. More specifically VIR and the 720S. Practice = brilliant, TT = crap.

As I think about it more,

Add a check box in practice to time the first lap and start on the track instead of the pits. Add a way to run against your own ghost in practice and then just ditch TT altogether. If someone needs to show off their alien roots just post your lap on YT.

Stop wasting development cycles on TT and concentrate on other areas.

 

Dont you think its a bit overkill to completely delete this player mode from AMS2 because 1 new member are unable to control his car?
Because thats what I think.

 

Ok, I'll by that. So what's the main purpose of TT? To publicly compete against the best times for any given car and any given track and have those results posted on a leader board. Right? Fact is that the vast majority of people will never come close to the so called aliens that traverse the tacks claiming the top spots. Mostly all the same people. So really what's the point of TT? Compete against the middle of the pack 10 pages down and maybe move up a spot or two? The only "real" fun would be competing against yourself and bettering your own times. Don't need an entire section of the game for that. Add a time trial button to practice with your own ghost to drive against and bob's your uncle. Entire development cycles for Reiza not needed anymore poof.

 

Edit I retracted my disagree imoji and wrote this instead
So as the op suggest report properly your grievance/issues. As suggested load your own ghost and learn from it. Use it as a tool. both to improve and report
The reason for OP was because of recognised /reported issues the idea is to report them here so they can be looked at and changed if neccessary. There are other TT threads to say things such as

Realy? that would be a backward step for any sim, irrespective of its state of development.

1, They are improving the sim in several areas including TT at the same time. No easy task as ie a tyre//track suspension etc update may throw other improvements out. Frustrating yes but.
2 They are tweeking default setups some have suffered, some are great, its called development! 1 day most if not all will please 99% of people in default but its not there yet for many reasons.

Try loading a 720s ghost setup, save it then retry Virginia and see if its better for you

Its integral to most if not all sims.
Practice day/session needs its ghost as I suggested many times elswhere.

I will try the 720s which I dont like, for its default setup and rear end stability, that I only tried once. I will test it at Virginia and then load a ghost setup to try handling, followed buy TT. just to compare as per your example Practice to TT.

 

OK I had originally decided not to waste more time on you.
But then you did completely reveal that your prtoblem is not that you cannot control the car - but your problem is your attitude.
The reason I get a lot of fun competing in the TT sessions is because I dont have a problem when somebody is able to lap a track faster than me.
I dont outpour my frustration about such laughable little problem by claiming that because I personally is unable to beat some people above me on a LB list then this list and the whole TT mode has to be deleted from a racing game.

ByTheWay: Enough of this nonsense. I have better things to do. Like trying to beat some drivers above me on the LB in the F-reiza on Interlagos historic. And have fun while Im trying