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Same old .....

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - General Discussion' started by Simmo99x, Jul 16, 2020.

  1. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    You could also copy his setup.
     
  2. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    Its not a bug per-se. Its an anomaly with the tire mechanics where high tire pressures gain straight line speed but aren’t offset with loss of grip or unfavorable driving characteristics. This leads to unrealistic setups being the fastest.

    Its also not an obvious “flip the switch” situation either. Most people copy an alien’s setup anyway. Then they come to threads like this looking for ways to use it, but probably already are.
     
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  3. InfernalVortex

    InfernalVortex Active Member

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    Are you sure? Higher tire pressures on the cars I drive make the cars nearly undriveable. It's absolutely faster in a straight line, but it's a nightmare to keep it on the road.
     
  4. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    Yes. Specifically for TT where the track is rubbered in”. In other game modes it is much more difficult. It also depends on the type of car you’re driving.

    open the diff, soften the roll bars, add pressure, reduce drag. Thats the TT playbook.

    edit: oh, and Im not talking about "max pressure" or anything gimmicky like that. Its within driveable reason. and I should add, we are talking about hundreths of seconds or roughly a car length, depending on the straightaway. Not massive differences, but enough that adds up over a lap that is particularly noticeable to the top 20% of leaderboard drivers. especially those like the OP (presumably).
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  5. InfernalVortex

    InfernalVortex Active Member

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    With the F Retro or F-Vintage (most of my time is in those) lowering the pressures makes the cars noticeably easier to drive, and noticeably slower. I probably spend at least 75 percent of my time in TT mode just because I find it to be good practice. The F-Retros at 1.5 bar are undriveable. Same with low downforce... I did have a pretty good lap at Imola 72 with the df turned really low and the pressure bumped up a little (after I discovered how much quicker high pressures were at Spielberg 75 or whatever year it is), but it was a ragged edge, 10 tries to get one clean lap kinda lap, and even that one probably has another second in it if you can hang onto it, but it was a challenge for sure. I definitely didnt feel like I was "cheating" at all on that one. Especially since I kept having to bring the tire pressure back down to be able to control it.
     
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  6. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    Its not cheating or an exploit IMO. Its just maximizing the generally forgiving tire model. You still have to drive you ass off. We are talking perfect cornering vs perfect cornering, the high pressure tire will be faster down the following straight. Especially with momentum type cars. Thats it. I appreciate the OP pointing it out, but my opinion is that its very specific, very minor (for the average driver) and reserved for the upper echelons of TT players. If you are not driving perfect laps on a consistent basis you might not even notice a time difference.

    What I definitely agree with the OP is that if you devote the time to set-ups, like I do, you find yourself slower in TT and that's frustrating.
     
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  7. Andy-R

    Andy-R Active Member Reiza Backer

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    Default seems fine in the F Retro's, I havent tried higher but I have gone lower and I also found it slower. I go 1 click down on the fronts sometimes but for no real reason, just for the love of clicking stuff. IIRC the RL driver Maser V6 was talking to said never beyond 18psi IRL so I tried that and it was too slow. Seems like 18psi would be better for the tyres coming alive within a couple of laps but you lose too much straight line speed.
     
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  8. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    I think you nailed it. The grip through the corner and corner exit, with lower pressures does not offset the speed advantage of high pressure. With fresh tires in TT, the high pressure tires give you plenty of grip.

    As far as RL is concerned, its always going to be controversial. There is no right or wrong. The game's tire model is not necessarily based on the characteristics of a tire used in a RL car or series. Think of it this way, AMS2s cars, regardless of the series, have the same extremely user friendly super generic tire manufacturer. With optimal tire temps that are between 30 degrees C. and grip levels that may or may not even be realistic in that window.
     
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  9. Auduns75

    Auduns75 RWB Audi Reiza Backer

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    I've noticed that many of the default setups are shipped with way to low pressures. Found that the Ginetta GT4 was at least 0.15 bar to low. That has a huge impact on handling.
    Tire pressures are always the first thing I sort when setting up a car, no point in adjusting springs and dampers if the important contact patch is out wack. And you want an omi spread between 8 and 10 degrees.
     
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  10. neal

    neal Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I agree, but we need to know what those pressures or the actual preferred range of pressures. Do teams in real life have to guess tyre pressures and go out on track and trial and error until they get them correct?
     
  11. Marius H

    Marius H Well-Known Member Reiza Backer

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    About tyre pressures. I do not have the feeling they make a great impact in AMS 2. In AMS 1 tyre pressure and temperature play so large role it's the first thing I always adjust according to car and track. In AMS 2 brake ducts play a larger role. I can put 20 less or 20 more tyre pressure in AMS 2 and I barely see or feel any difference.
     
  12. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    Try Bathurst or Speilburg GT4 or anty of the P classes please.
     
  13. Auduns75

    Auduns75 RWB Audi Reiza Backer

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    Since the tire model is adopted from pc2, which had a general correct pressure of 1.8 bar for most cars, I use that as a starting point. Works for most tin tops
     
  14. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    Depends, you can run higher pressures on less dependant aero cars, and get away with really low pressures on cars that depend on aero but once removed.
     
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  15. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    Most of the times i've run are Default setups, but i was just doing some testing on TT with a few different setups.
    I found that you can get away with 0 aero/camber/toe and very high or very low tyres pressures, i'm talking maxed out/min.( depends on aero dependant or not)
    Only on TT yes the car is not easy to drive, and will not suit alot of drivers, but if mastered can achieve crazy results.
    In the case of GT4 or even P1 from Default up to 3 seconds.
    Same conditions, just crazy and shouldn't be attainable really, maybe 1 second.
    For example if you run Speilberg GT4 Default the car feels great to me, then load your ghost and apply the settings, you can pull 1 second on each straight, but at no cost to your cornering speed.
     
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  16. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    I love the game and want it to do well, but i'm just being honest with the setup issue i believe can be exploited but not by everyone.
    I accept that a few tenths can and should be achieved with extreme settings, but at the cost of lower cornering speeds, which in turn will balance out the overall lap times.
    Overall though i just want it to be a more realistic/balanced game.
    It also keeps TT a lot closer/competitive without the extremes.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2020
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  17. steelreserv

    steelreserv Active Member

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    I agree with your sentiment 100%. Its simply correlated to the generous tire model which makes the game accessible to players that don’t have the time, willingness or expertise to figure out a realistic setup. The temp range of the tires is huge, but more germaine to this convo is the pressure. In ACC for example the pressure window is quite small and deviations can indeed be noticed on track. Its also easily fixed as cambers are generally set properly by default. In AMS2 defaults are kind of a mess. Drivable, certainly, but you can tell the specific car and track combos were not adjusted by default. Instead, the default is simply in a “drivable“ window.
    I saw you had a WR in a sprint car at Kyalami, which means you’re very fast and obviously in touch with the intricacies of setups. I don’t think its an exploit, but instead you know what you are doing and able to take advantage of it but at the same time your immersion is diminished. The fastest setups shouldn’t be the fastest, or at least should have drawbacks which right now don’t exist.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2020
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  18. David Wright

    David Wright Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I have watched a lot of PC2 set-up videos for hot-lapping and never come across these exploits. So out of curiosity I downloaded the WR setups for several cars for Brands Hatch GP. The Porsche 911 GT3 R, the Ginetta G55 GT4 and the Toyota TS50, all by different hot-lappers.

    None had all the aero removed. None had all the camber removed. None had all the toe removed. I'm not sure what you mean by "break the tyre pressures/anti-roll bars" so its hard to comment on these but the arb settings were not far from the defaults.

    I have no idea what exploits work for AMS2 but if all the above work for AMS2 its not because they are carried across from PC2.
     
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  19. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Member

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    It's not always 0 but basically minimum/what the cars allows.
    Set a time in Default/suits your style, then put all of the above settings to min allowed and then race your previous ghost, watch as it disappears.
    It used to be in Pcars 1 at the start of the games release, and everything had to be reset then.
    Similar to Rfactor 2 tuning aswell.
    Just a bit of a deal breaker but still enjoying the game so far.
     

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