Stabilise GT3 G2 akin to ACC?

I cant make the M3 GT3 spin on the turns, let alone on the straights, go figure.
Someone else in here is having any problem with any of the GT3?

 

You keep saying that, but you have not proved it yet... Its soo easy to spin the GT3 after 1.6

 

You want a video in any track or any in specific? The only way I find they easy to spin is making mistakes in trail braking, from throtle I cant see how.

 

There you go, i did have to save a few times but it was because I overdid the corner, for me its normal behavior.
Why would I pretend that there is no issue for me if it was? You didnt see me asking the guy proof that his car was spinning, anyway, either there is some problem in your settings or some misterious bug that only affect some, or maybe you just overdrive too much and expect AMS2 to drive like some other sim you like or something, thats ok too.

 

In that video you can see you are indeed driving cautiously, not aggressively and you did have to save the care a few times where in other sims you wouldn't have as your TC would have stepped in.

There is a fundamental issue with either TC.

Now you say you "cant" make the car spin, i think everyone can agree that its very easy to make the car spin and i would politely request that with the same setup, you do another video of you doing donuts in that car by dumping the throttle and having ther car on full lock or taking the car to adelade and dumping the throttle while in hairpins etc and DONT try to save the car.

Thbe point here is that the TC is not stepping it to the degree it should, it should slow you down, bog the car down like in real life as you CAN NOT donut a car with TC on 10 in any other sim.

You keep saying you "cant" spin the car, well go to adelade, turn the steering on full lock from a stand still, put your clutch down, full throttle, 1st gear, dump the clutch and the car with do donuts all day. Now you "CAN" spin the car. Congrats...

However, what is being said on reddit/GTP/Overtake is that this should be technically impossible as the car should bog down as it would IRL and in all other sims and TC would need to be off to donut the car to that degree.

I believe you can spin the car, its not hard at all. If you cant you must have an issue somewhere as everyone can spin that car on demand if they want to?

Its super easy, and thats the crux. Yes i can change my driving style and catch the car like you did in the video and thats great if i use an AGGRESSIVE setup, but on a stable setup i should NOT be able to donut a GT3 car with TC on 10 and MAX stability from a stand still or a hairpin.

Thats the point, i think TC is not functioning as aggressively as it should or TC2 and CUT is not implemented correctly as in other sims and IRL.

 

I’ve always thought something feels wrong with TC and maybe not letting us adjust TC2 is the issue

 

Maybe I don't understand the point of the conversation above, but when I try to recover after a spinout in a tight place, I have to switch off TC to make half of a donut and point the car in the right direction. With TC on, it doesn't want to do this.

 

Why would I not try to save the car? But ok, later tonight I'll try doing a donut.
So you are saying is that in real life if a GT3 in a tight spot you cant to a donut to get in the right direction? It will have to austin powers its way to the right direction again? Not even with droping the clutch?

I dont know why I'm even bothering anymore, but from your logic lauching the car like this shouldnt be possible, is that it? Also when he loose the rear he just just give up and spin, got it.

 

I don't think you are doing it on purpose, i believe you have a lot of useful input and this topic needs people to look at it objectively...

However...its' challenging to converse with you on this particular topic for a number of reasons.

1) Invoking / Discussing the Porsche, The BMW M4 GT3 G2 is the primary focus being discussed here and elsewhere on line, stay on topic.

2) You claim you "CANT" spin the BMW M4 GT3 G2, no matter how hard you try? If you honestly believe that, there is a bigger issue at play with you system/game/setup as that car is very easy to spin if you TRY!

3) You show a video of a Mercedes GT3 "wheel spinning" out the pits... However, as you can see from the dash board he has TC DISABLED and literally ENABLES TC to 8 at 1:08 / 1:09 after exiting the pits! He anables TC to STOP his wheels spinning!

4) When you turn to insults, suggesting that my statement "when you lose the rear, don't try to catch it" was/is some kind to stupid comment, it isnt. As when you do the EXACT same thing in other sims (with TC on 10 using a STABLE setup etc) the car will save itself, it will bog down, stop the wheels spinning and the TC will kick in and do the job it was implemented to do, to literally STOP the car from spinning and killing you.

I'm not attacking the game, its not personal, but for the love of god you are swinging both ways here and contradicting yourself, moving goalposts, showing real life cars "wheel spinning" with "TC OFF" and now getting personal with insults?

Come on man...

There is an issue with TC as you should NOT be able to spin the BMW M4 GT3 G2 out from first gear and donut the thing using a full stable setup and TC 10 etc.

Again, just to hammer the point home... You showed a video of a driver "DISABLING TC" to wheel spin a Mercedes and then "ENABLING TC" after exiting the pits as if this is somehow helpful to this discussion regarding the BMW M4 GT3 G2 in AMS2?

If anything it strengthens my point and diminishes yours, but in all honestly its not that relevant to the point here, TC/TC1/2/TC Cut etc. are not stopping the car as they should, if there WERE you would NOT be able to donut the car from first gear with all of these aids on MAX as they are literally designed to NOT allow you to do that and slow you down and save you.

 

How can i ask if i should let the car spin an insult, are you that sensitive? If I'm trying to drive the car of course suggesting I should just let it go is stupid. I honestly didnt notice the TC was off, but anyway, you see the guy having to catch the rear sometimes.
I think its fine, you think its not, I dont even care for GT3 that much, I dont know why I'm bothering.
Would be better if some dev would show up and say what is what. But they dont seem to do that as much this side of the forum anymore.

 

Because if i was discussing the damage model, and said drive the car full throttle into a wall... You would come out and say the same thing... "ohh what real life driver would drive full throttle into a wall and not apply the brake" "OK then"... etc. You are challenging to converse with as you detract, invoke fallacy and obfuscate.

Not catching the slide is integral to the point being made as we need to demonstrate the fail safe "NOT" activating under these conditions!

If "YOU" catch the slide "YOU" become the fail safe (TC in this case).

The TC should be bogging the car down, slowing the car down, using all of its compute (and millions of pounds worth of R&D) to moderate power to the wheels to STOP that spin from happening (when set to MAX and on a FULL STABLE setup).

If there is no possible way to have a FULL STABLE setup in AMS2 then that in its self is a issue.

Its really not hard to understand, and this is a heavily discussed topic online. The hope is that Reiza will indeed bring the TC up to snuff with other sims (and IRL cars) so we can turn it DOWN for an aggressive setup, but also turn it UP if we want a stable setup for track learning, testing, guests etc. Just like IRL and all other sims!

 

I'm kinda surprised to know that GT3 TC in real life is that invasive, is it really an absolute failsafe to spins at level 10? You make a good point if its the case.
But I always see the drivers making small corrections in racing. However you made it sound like the GT3s in AMS2 are on ice all the time, but its not the case, they are perfectly raceable, maybe its not realistic, maybe it is, maybe all the other sims are wrong and AMS 2 is right haha, maybe we will know when we drive a real GT3, at least for me I dont see it ever happening.
I stand corrected, I can make them spin if I really try, but why would I?

 

Well, again… you would do this to see if the fail safe kicks in as expected. Much like we crash cars to see if they pass safety tests.

No one said all GT3s are not on ice?
It was never framed this way at any point. This again is fallacy being invoked to obfuscate and detract from the point at hand. This method of communication simply halts constructive discussion.


The long and short is this:
The BMW M4 GT3 G2 is not acting life it’s real life counterpart, or how it is portrayed in EVERY other sim!

The question is why?

Again… As explained previously the issue being discussed is with the BMW M4 GT3 G2 in AMS2 v1.6.6.

Is this because TC2/TC CUT etc is not accessible or even implemented in AMS2 (as they are not in the setup menu) like they are in these other sins and IRL?

Is this a setup issue? Tyre model? Lack of proper coding of all electronic Aids? Other?

I don’t know, but for sure 100% this is an issue as no other sim works the way this sim does with its implementation of this car?

 

With my basic knowledge of the madness engine and vehicle dynamics, IMO it’s the implementation of TC which is the issue

 

You see, I didnt even know these were a thing, now I learned. You did say you have to feather the throtle, avoid curbs, grass (that one I understand, its ice on AMS2), that it is so bad you have to abandon the game, while I was slamming the throtle at 1st gear with TC 6 on the exit of the hairpin over the curbs and it was fine.
Its a problem for you its not 100% realistic, I get it, maybe one day Reiza will do it properly
I wont try Adelaide because I dont drive on it since GP2 times and now I completely forgot and suck at it.
Now I'll see myself out, cheers.

 

Try first some more extreme setup changes (and if those help, come back a bit and try to find balance)

front slow rebound to min
Rear slow bump to min
Front springs to max

see if that would help with the issue and if it does, you can then try similar but slight less min-max settings

not going to argue about TC etc. I use TC to make it safer, but I don’t expect it to make it on rails.

 

I have tried BMW M4 GT3 G2 and... yes, it makes donuts with TC10. It's weird. OP is right.

 

Can it maybe mean it doesn't activate enough?

 

Something that hasn't been mentioned in thsi thread from what i've seen - AMS2 has a more realistic throttle model, which leads to higher torque at lower revs than specifically ACC, as well as others (at the moment, all Kunos games, and RF2.) When coming out of a corner in ACC, you can just blast the throttle because as you step it up most of the torque comes at the end anyway... in AMS2 which has a correct throttle model, there is more torque at lower throttle levels, so you need more control. TC of course aids in this, but it is not just TC at fault. See Niels Heusinkveld's videos on youtube, which i will admit is just where i got my info from (I am merely a conduit to people more informed). I think this causes a lot of problems for people who are used to "other sims", but those sims are themselves using a poor model. So, of course it will seem like AMS2 is harder or "wrong".

Just something that I felt was worth mentioning.

Also, why would full TC make spinning impossible? I'm sure it would make it less likely at a given throttle level, but if you're really trying to spin a car that has so much power, would it make sense to disconnect the throttle and engine behaviour so much as to avoid spins AT ANY COST, via TC? that doesn't seem likely (and I don't know enough physics to know how hard it would be, beyond having a completely drive-by-wire system that essentially gave a completely non linear function between throttle pedal and throttle behaviour). It does not seem likely to me that the calibration of TC in a real car would be done to stop spins at the torque levels that can be caused in first gear in such powerfully-engined cars regardless of how hard you try. They're probably more calibrated for a certain range that fits most cases. In situations where TC is relevant, the car is already moving and the wheels have a relatively smooth transition between traction/spin. TC is not a panacea, surely, for the potential for wheel spin.