To Reiza: What physics do you actually want?

I’m sorry but probably my Amiga500 had better resolution than those pictures…

Where can I see INDIVIDUAL tire longitudinal and lateral forces?

 

Nice videos and very interesting read from all parties here. One thing to note though is that in 1986 there was no refuelling and those turbos where very fragile, so on those onboards they are not at the limit. Unfortunately I cant find any onboard lap from any of Senna's poles that year, but from the tv cameras you can see some traction loss on acceleration in his qualy lap in Brands Hatch.
Now I am actually curious to try the car in PC2 to see how it compares, will do later and see, because so far none of the repeat cars from both games feel better in PC2.

 

Not sure what you are getting at with quoting my post. That its me?

 

Slick D, 30L (8laps), don't have exact lap but it was about 1:31.

 

Just to put some clarity here, equal torque on both wheels of a driven axle means OPEN diff…

 

Dont forget to pick the historic/vintage tires in the setup menu.

 

out of curiosity would it be possible to port ams2 ffb into pcars 2?

 

There are some custom ffb-files converted to PC2 by Karsten (iirc) but, not sure where they can be found. I would check the PC2 forums or, possibly at RaceDept.

 

The differential is not locked even then. What happens then is that the torque that is equal to the resistance of these clutches is applied to both wheels. But again, this doesnt mean they have the same speed, the wheels are still free to spin at diferent speeds. This is what is important here, If what you say was true then any road car with an LSD would drag wheels around when its pushed around a garage spot. This is not the case.

But i've read this definition worded like that before, and it seems to be some sort of law propagated in simracing circles.

The preload is basically a starting force on the clucthes. It allows the diff to reach higher percentages of torque transfer at a faster rate. Its not "locking" the wheels to each other.

 

Its a bit off topic, but the custom files actually started in PC2 , and as it developed was the starting point for Ams2 customs, so there is a lot of the custom file language that can be received or understood by the engine in general , there are some differing core dependencies that require specific implementation.
But this is only in reference to Custom FFB of course which is quite bespoke and has moved far away from the Fx,Fy,Fz etc of PC2.

 

If you have a preload between the shafts this is the minimum torque needed for achieving a speed difference across the wheels so, yes, it is always acting as soon as the car starts turning.

In my experience anyway its influence is so low with reasonable values it is barely noticeable only when going close to the limit (or very slowly).

 

Oh yes, its always acting, but its not "locking" the shaft tight. The transfer of torque is always happening, but if a car turns for example, this transfer of torque happens on a corner from one wheel to the other no matter what, but again they can rotate at different speeds.

 

This is a very good video:

 

Isn’t this a open diff?

(This is indeed Lego)

 

of course they can and the difference in torque needed for doing so is causing a yaw momentum to be compensated.

We are on the same page Richard

 

yes

 

lol. No, on the contrary, sry if you misinterpreted, I used it to show how some people find the throttle in this case you. other quotes I deleted to keep the post short. We do adapt to things that are not correct and it came be then accepted/put to back of mind to a degree over time, esp when other correct things overshadow flaws.

 

So after a quick test, I can see your point at least after the 3 laps it took the rears to get some heat and stopped the wheel spin. The car felt a lot like AC where you can feel the weight of the car around the corners, but like AC and ACC what gives me the "feel" where not the tires, but the weight transfer of the car. I am no physics expert nor have any experience driving race cars but I think the reason AMS2 feels different to many people is that there is not that pronounced feel of weight that other sims have, maybe it's because of the tire model being so advanced, I dunno. GT7 is another game where the physics feel more tuned to the weight of the cars, not the tires being in contact with the road, I actually feel it very similar to ACC, haven't driven it with a wheel though.

However I did not have any problems with the 98t on AMS2 at all, did a 1:09 flat at Brands Hatch with just a little adjustment to the front wing to reduce the understeer and increase the boost to 80% in 6 laps, could go full throttle with some wheelspin and didn't had to let go of the gas. I do agree that the replay view did look better on PC2, but maybe it's because of the cameras, the little twitches the car made in AMS2 when breaking traction looked quite similar to Senna Brands Hatch lap. I liked the way the car drove a lot.

So I think it's a matter of preferences really, I like most of the major sims and own pretty much all of them. Which is the most realistic? We would need a pro driver driving all of them to really give his opinion.

 

I wish I could find the quote because I hate to misquote people, but Renato wrote a few months back something along the lines that he thinks the FFB in many sims puts too much emphasis on the weight on the front wheels, or maybe he wrote "driving by front feel" or something like that – suggesting or implying that Reiza wants to de-emphasize that effect in their FFB. And that certainly can be a factor that plays in when it comes to the lack of feeling weight transfer that many have reported in this thread.

EDIT: I could be misremembering things that others have paraphrased (Mandela effect). The closest quote I could find with my search on this forum was this one: