Automobilista 2 April 2023 Development Update

dont tease me like that man

id love to have those boys...

 

There currently is a pretty good balance now if you don't use the clutch on downshifts. I know because I've ran into it more then a few times (during a race) and when you don't get the blip correct on the clutchless downshift you grind gears. If do that a few times.. Well... you loose the gear or the clutch. Again I've done it a few times already. I use clutchless downshifts on and off in AMS2 and it depends on my mood. If I wanna be fast I do clutchless downshifts but if I'm in the mood to just heel toe then I do that and it's more then clutchless.

Funny thing with me. I learned how to heel toe downshift playing Forza3 on my full fanatec setup and moved it over to real life and it's the only way I downshift now.

 

I believe he is saying that is much harder to be consistent and avoid mistakes in long races using h shifter. In real life until the late 80s there were countless times where a driver was overtaken after missing a gear when under pressure for example. It is more tiresome for the driver as well. One of the hardest things in Monaco was to cope with 2 hours of relentless gear changes, to the points several drivers had severe blisters by the end of the race. After all, there’s a reason paddle shifters we’re implemented right?

 

Not in the sense of timing and execution, but yes in terms of consistency and braking if you heel & toe, engine and gearbox wear concerns, miss-shifting, etc.

Late EDIT: Most and foremost, even if you easily can match what the aids provide, in the end those aids are masquerading a proper and real skill needed to realistically drive those cars, providing people who don't have the skill to be on par with the people who drive them without aids.

I think it's something like the TC/ABS/Stability aids (the game ones, not the real by the car). Those aids always are slower than not using it, and that's ok. If you want to be faster, you have to learn to control the car, learn to brake, learn to be smooth on throttle application. I hope you get what I mean.

 

Your quote is better than mine, thanks

 

Yet, if you do it well in the cars that have/had sequential or h-pattern you will go faster than you would in autoclutch or full auto.

I remember that when I first started on a wheel, I couldn't even wrap my head around racing at pace in manual, so I used auto. Once I changed to manual I realised how slow it was and all of the benefits to car control that came with it, it is a handling tool in itself. You gain time by doing it but you also are more challenged.

All of that took time though and I was already able to drive stick before I started racing, lots of people don't take manual driving tests any more. People should be able to choose what suits their level and progress, there is no need to punish or weigh down those people because when you get it right, you will be quicker.

 

Yes, I totally agree with your points. Everyone should enjoy AMS2 regardless of driving aids/input method. But I believe my point was more regarding that there might be an advantage regarding consistency / risk of mistakes etc in long races using paddle shifter vs h shifter. At least this is my perception. But everyone should enjoy this sim regardless of the input method

 

So it's about time that we can see who drove his TT time with which driving aids. Why on earth is that after 3 years AMS2 still not displayed in the leaderboard. It is logged in the background but not displayed.
It would certainly also be an incentive for others to move around the track as realistically as possible.

 

It seems that my 18 year old brain has A LOT to learn about manual transmissions.

 

Yeah and you're absolutely right, the cost of mistakes is much higher but yields extra rewards. That same idea can be extended though, I would suggest that over a 3 hour period, someone driving in auto is more likely to have lapses in focus than someone in full manual due to how engaged you have to be.

Clearly some things are compromises to make it accessible to more people and a wider range of abilities, but I reckon someone serious enough to expend hours learning heel-toe is unlikely to lose to someone casually jumping in in auto. What do you think?

 

It takes A LOT of practice to properly heel toe down shift and not upset the car / weight balance if you downshift mid corner (some times you just have to). It also takes even more practice if you want to use clutchless downshifts at one point in the lap but then use heel toe in another part of the lap and left foot trail braking somewhere else. There is just SO much going on in the heat of the moment where your feet can get confused....... But again with a lot of patience and a lot of practice you can get it if you want to and if you learn it in a sim then you don't have to worry about blowing up your transmission or clutch in your IRL car. I just find it very rewarding to heel toe downshift IRL and in the sim world which is why I do it so much.

One of the best ways to practice these days (for me) is to take the German Group A BMW M3 around the Gesamtstrecke while heel toeing and left foot braking for trail braking (brake pedal to turn the car) and chain those corners together. It's just........ fantastic.

 

I wonder as we get closer to v1.5 if there might be some love shown for gamepad support. I drive with a wheel on my PC, but I play AMS2 a lot on my Steam Deck which uses gamepad interaction. The driving is almost there with the pad, but there are a couple of issues with response around the centre of the steering, as if there is still a deadzone even with steering deadzone at zero, so fine control can be a bit frustrating. AMS1 on the Deck has excellent feel with the pad controls, but it was always a bit of an issue with PC2, so in the spirit of ongoing refinements the Madness Engine it would be great to see some attention to controller support.
There are other long standing issues with controlling the UI too but I think there is a small army of pad players here that would happily support Reiza with testing and feedback once this gets to the front of the queue.

 

I think that always someone heavily commited to learn something will be better than a casual besides the aids involved.

What I'm not so sure is if two equally commited players, one using autoclutch and the other heel toeing, the latter will be faster in the long run and in a track where having the posibility to quickly up/downshift mid corner without the risk of upsetting the car is the faster way.

On that M1 video posted, there are some quick gear changes mid corner that to me are impossible on manual. I'm not saying that it's impossible for all, but certainly for me it is unless I put hours and hours developing the skill, while with autoclutch in the way I could do that immediately.

I don't know if what I said has any sense to you, I'm not a native English spoken person, my apologies for that.

Cheers

 

not everyone has access to Manual shifters.
so i think Ams2 has implemented auto clutch well.
There’s a clear disadvantage in straight line acceleration when using auto clutch with paddles . somehow manual shifting is able to get through the shift faster if they are proficient at it .
someone who is proficient at manual shifts is going to perform better than a paddle shifter. But there is definitely a advantage for the auto shift in terms of fatigue over a long stint and busy track car combos. and also lees chance of damage.
but you can still suffer clutch damage with paddles if using the clutch in take offs etc .

i just wish there was some manual shifters out there that weren’t so noisy. so i could get one

 

I also like your points, they are valid too. Maybe all this interesting subject is getting a bit out of hand, as my initial comment was that someone driving a BMW M1 with no assists but using paddle shifter instead of a h shifter would be quicker, not that someone with auto clutch or auto shifting. But I believe if we had 3 drivers with same skill, and we asked the 3 to do a full lap in a BMW M1 at gesamtstreicke, for me the quickest would be :
1-Paddle shifter with no aids
2-h shifter with no aids
3-auto shifting

For all the great examples shared by several users, I feel that a skilled driver will be able to turn more precisely, and go thru the gear changes quicker than if doing it via h shifter, with also less risks of errors / imprecision than h shifter.

and I agree that the auto shifting will make for a safer ride but without taking advantage of car control manual clutch and shifter provide.

 

I'm not sure whether it is the case here, but there IS a bug with AMS2 where the deadzones don't get saved properly. Currently the best solution I've found is resetting the controls to defaults, change deadzones to 0, and then NOT touch the preset buttons for steering. As soon as I overwrite these, the deadzone returns.

With the way my settings are, there is no deadzone.

 

From what I understand the touring car vintages and GT classics already got part of these tires adjustments, so I went to try the 2002, the Mini and the Corvette C3R, if that is the case I think this is going in the right direction, even the C3R doesnt feel like I'm driving a Tugboat anymore, they feel more connected.
But I dont know, maybe someone with better eyes for physics could give their opinion.

 

The C3R is a beast if you tweak the setup a bit. Currently it's got a nasty entry understeer and the front brakes become overheated too quickly. Grip up the front a bit more and shift the brakes rearwards and it becomes much more nimble.

Hopefully the GT Classics class gets some more additions in the future. Both the 911 RSR and C3R feel great, but are miles off of each other in laptime.