Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - News & Announcements' started by Renato Simioni, Jan 30, 2021.
Where is the adapter that turns the H-pattern into sequential spring action?
Personally I believe all these odd things (cars bouncing, camera/worldMov, diff, ao,...) is the downside of all the "free" things Reiza have got by buying the Madness engine.
By "free" things I mean all the Mad features Reiza dont have to write code to themselves.
The disadvantage by this is that Reiza is only able to communicate to the Mad engine from the "outside" because this engine is some kind of black box - a finished construction.
ByTheWay: The communication to the Mad box is via Reizas own parameters - obviously often different from pCars2 parameters.
I just got the same in Steam from Spelunky 2 so probably any game (that uses VC++) you happen to launch today triggers update to VC++ redistributables.
Yup, another example is X-Plane 11 which, does shader pre-caching updates sometimes and also welcomes me with the first times setup message. Perfectly normal for steam applications.
I've understood that Reiza were given access to source code of Madness engine. Source:
Automobilista 2: The Big Interview - Part 1
So they can take it apart if they needed to.
But you are correct in essence. It is not a black box, but having a full access does not mean that one can do changes without studying the implementation first. They probably try to avoid looking at some (most) parts of the code too deeply, unless some very specific issues can be derived happening at certain simulated aspect in the engine. When the engine is ready, most of the work happens outside of it anyway.
Correct, it was communicated several times to the public.
An example here, that they have full access, is the FFB system, that is torn out of the system and replaced by Reiza-own-sorcery.
Other examples are the new tools to better work out AI performance in changing weather conditions.
Ok the bit you are asking about is the 3drap part. That link just the adaptor which allows you to plug it into your PC if you don't have a g29 wheel, which I don't. I think Roby was actually looking for purchase reasons, hence why I shared that. Also, simple hair bands suffice in making a spring for the g29 shifter, so you don't even necessarily need that 3drap sequential plate. But it's the software which changes the behaviour of the shifter so it doesn't default back to neutral. It makes it hold the gear whilst being in the centre.
You've thos real soft tiny balls aka toys for cats. Just put two of that that inside your G29 shifter and boom you've a seq-stick, or 1 and you've a on/off handbrake. With a bodnar adapter you even have analoge input. But honestly I would just order a SHH or a Fanatec shifter. For the ease of mind
In the words of Mick Hucknall, money's too tight to mention.
Yeah I have seen that official announcement too - but honestly I interpret it slightly different.
A rhetorical question: How would it sound if Reiza had announced that they have bought into the Madness engine - but wasnt allowed access to the code itself?
But anyway. With or without access to the code I have some (rather humble) experience in reading and correcting some others program code (database code) - and my oppinion is therefore that if you havent been part of the development of such a complex program then its rather theoretically that you afterwards would like to mess with the orig code.
ByTheWay: Even if we take the official announcement for real - then I consider the Madness engine as some kind of black box. For one reason or another.
What like ACC or AC I'm more than happy with AMS2 FFB just need to be able to adjust and save all sliders per car
Guy told me he repaired the car in pits, but he still appears to be heavily damaged. Performance was fine.
Read the latest patch notes, Reiza scrapped part of the Madness code and put their AMS based one....
Also Reiza stated several times there are some similarities between AMS code and Madness one and this gives them space to edit/fix things...of course they need some time to explore all the options in the game engine and suit them for their purposes but we also know this is going to be a long term project....
At least I do agree that it (probably by garantee) will take looong before the worst issues/bugs has been solved/sidestepped in the Mad engine.
The only thing that keeps me away from going back to my former prefered racing game Raceroom is that there is something special by the car handling/behaviour in AMS2 that gives me a unique feeling of contact with the tarmac. A feeling I dont get in any other game(rF2, Raceroom, ACC). Hehe dont mention iRacing
ByTheWay: I have to admit that beside this single extremely urgent behaviour thing then Im fed up with as example the setup file save/load "system" and much of the chaotic TT menus.
If you as example in a TT session want to save or alter a setup file after being on track - then you have to completely exit the session and then restart a new one just to be able to contact or change the used setup. Hehe come on Reiza?
I would more interpret it as:
"Data generated in our previous game, AMS1, with some adaptation is now feed the to madness engine algorithms and processed/used there."
Regarding changing the engine, I think that would entirely depend on what kind of license they got, I would not expect a blackbox/closed source as this probably would make long term perspectives a huge challenge, if not impossible as you cannot change base behavior if you wanted, even with data feeding the engine there would be a point of 'well I have this data, but the engine cannot consume it in any way'. So I would guess it's a more collaborative license, where you can have the source, but changes should be shared 'upstream' - which would be great for future perspectives of the engine as it would continue to increment functionality (and complexity), but that's just how it is in software development.
This is not a bad description of the reason I (moi) interpret Reizas access to the Madness engine as more "external".
Because I consider a lot of the unsolved strange behaviours in the AMS2 like camera/car bouncing and differential behaviour as the result of your: 'well I have this data, but the engine cannot consume it in any way'
ByTheWay: That could also explain why it until now have been impossible for Raiza to solve some of the issues that looks like only 5 min into the source code could correct it. Sorry maybe 6 minutes
I mean there is no such thing of 5/6 minute fix in src code without proper testing, especially using a foreign base/engine, yourself mentioned it's (probably high)complexity, and even if there is super quick way, they probably have a bible sized book of issues to fix, eventually they cover it (but the bible of issues actively still gets new pages). But they have a good pace, every 6 months it looks quite changed overall.
I believe you guys are missing the point.
What worries me about the engine is not the Reiza's ability to learn about it and fix the bugs, but the inherent lack of important features in the engine that would require the team to actually develop over the existing code.
Developing over your own code is ok, developing new features based on someone's else code can be a nightmare, time consuming and expensive. For this reason, I'm afraid we are either never going to have or it will take a veeeeery long time for AMS2 to have the following features:
adjustable mirror angles (and self in rearview);
replay features such as: click the progress bar to navigate through it, more cameras, replay step-by-step, etc;
chopper/drone cameras for broadcasting and monitoring;
essential server hosting features such as: restarting the current session, reordering the grid, applying penalties (DT, SaG, +X secs, BF), admitting drivers in the server at any time, allow disconnected driver to reconnect (AI drives the car slowly to the pits while player is offline), etc
The last one is, in my opinion ofc, the most urgent and most relevant of them all. Possibly the most likely that will never be fully implemented, if it even can be done at all.
If Reiza manages to do it, AMS2 would be the most complete sim overall. Later on only needing to add small features such as different tyre compounds, limited set of tyres, fixing open wheelers visual camber, etc.
It's a difficult balance, more content, may bring more users, add those functionalities makes existing users happy. What is worth more? None, so they have to follow the 50/50 path.
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