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Automobilista 2 V1.1.4.0 RELEASED - Now Updated to v1.1.4.5

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - News & Announcements' started by Renato Simioni, Apr 17, 2021.

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  1. Kuku Maddog

    Kuku Maddog Active Member

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    Yeah but if they had that little friction ( like ice at the spa hair pin ) then they wouldn’t cope on fast turns regardless of high downforce.
     
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  2. oez

    oez Mayor of Long Beach

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    I dunno. An expert needs to chip in here, because I'm making an assumption right back at you here. But wouldn't downforce have added load on the tires and made the contact patch wider? Maybe lowering tire pressure helps low speed grip? But then makes them overheat and drag you down at high speed. My understanding is that bias ply tires ballooned a lot easier than radials when tire pressure did not suit load.
     
  3. sedesa tatasa2

    sedesa tatasa2 Member Reiza Backer

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    F3 tires generate max cornering force at too large slip angle.
     
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  4. AndreiC

    AndreiC Active Member Reiza Backer

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    It's the same problem all other Retro and Vintage cars have with their differential/transmission and it is also present in less extend with other cars.
    I would not mention this behavior here if I were you because people here see it as a realistic feature present only in AMS2(not joking, not being ironic). The easiest way to see there is something off with the transmission just go and do a few laps in AMS1 with the Brabham BT44 or rf2(not even pCars2 does not have this strange behavior).
     
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  5. Simmo99x

    Simmo99x Active Member

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    You've got to remember that these old retro cars are basically a big engine strapped to a go kart.
    To that end you need to adapt your driving style.
    Square off the corners where downforce is very little to none, slow -medium.
    Brake late, almost past the apex, get it rotating and back on the beans.
    There not really designed to hit apexs and carry good speed in the medium speed corners, and don't really have the mechanical grip of modern cars either.
    So driving them in the same style/manner as modern GP cars will only exaggerate the problems.
    Not saying they can't be improved though.
     
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  6. 2ndLastJedi

    2ndLastJedi Area 51 local Reiza Backer

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    Scroll up to post #48
     
  7. oez

    oez Mayor of Long Beach

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    The diff/understeer/snap behavior has been criticised for months here. Sure there are a couple people who think it/anything in its current state is fine, but I think feedback is welcome if you just ignore the yes people.

    I can’t say if it’s realistic. But AMS1 might in fact be too optimistic and inaccurate with its diff behavior. rF2 is not a perfect physics simulator either. People like them a lot, but this is a gray area with AMS2 at the other end of it. That Lotus 79 onboard I’ve seen suggests that at least that plows and slides at low speeds.

    Point is: just because sim A and B work in one way doesn’t mean they are accurate. I think it’s a fallacy to use other sims as strong evidence. And there is justifiably criticism of feedback when talking about a gray area like this.

    Edit: my original comment was hotheaded for my own reasons, sorry about that. I cleaned it up to stay on point.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2021
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  8. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Reiza Backer

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    The differential itself is reacting quite reasonable with F-Retro now at least on the coast side, if there is something to react to. It's not the only contributor anymore. It's also likely tire related. The case of these huge biasply tires is indeed a very special one in AMS2...

    There is probably no other car in AMS2, that i have driven and recorded wheelspeeds for that much and often, like the BT44 in the run of testing. So i can tell you this basically first hand.

    It's also a known class by Reiza, for having these issues still. (To a lesser extend, than months ago, but still)
    In terms of non-baked-in torque curves and driveline workwise, AMS2 has far more depth than AMS1. Ironing out the downsides is the catch. Some results are indeed more realistic, others are pure BS. :D
    AMS1 is also not working fully correct, when it comes to the way of differential reaction, if you mean that by transmission. It's actually also not the golden benchmark. The F-Retro in AMS1 is more enjoyable to drive though, indeed!
    I saw you making quite definitive statements about what issues tires have in the past. Have you recorded telemetry and want to share it or how do you know? :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2021
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  9. alink

    alink Well-Known Member

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    Great work as always REIZA!
    Thank you very much for this present
    But something went wrong with several helmet views (Classis G1, Classic G3, Brabham BT46B,...), fix it please...
     
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  10. Maser V6

    Maser V6 Old School. Enjoying AMS2.. ASSISTS OFF RACING Reiza Backer

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    Not a speedo or tach
    From elswhere.
    Btw, what is that big tachometer on the right of the BT46B cockpit for?

    In the video here.
    is a description at time stamp 5 mins approximate.

    #243 i and other essentials



    Maser V6 To RS
    Just a question regarding the Brabham fan car.
    Will/does the car have the atmospheric pressure gauge in dash/hud. (to busy looking where I was going to spot it.)
    If not in car atm will it appear, it may help with indication of downforce as was in the real car?

    Renato Simioni
    The real car had both an altimeter to gauge pressure in the undertray airflow (a safety measure to inform the driver in case the car got some damage to the side skirts that would unseal the floor and cause a major downforce loss) and an airspeed gauge so driver had an idea how much downforce he was getting at any given point, with a marked threshold indicating what he should try stay at; neither is functional in AMS2 atm and unlikely for the initial release, but we may try include a functional airspeed gauge eventually ; less value in the altimeter until damageable skirts are a thing.

    My first dislike, Mmm ever!!!!:D
    Working on my next vid now :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2021
  11. BrunoB

    BrunoB Un-Known Member

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    I wasnt in my most positive mood :mad:
     
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  12. oez

    oez Mayor of Long Beach

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    Yes, give us Long Beach!

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Leynad

    Leynad Active Member Reiza Backer

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    I can control the car with default-settings and also see the extreme understeer-behavior in the real videos. Very understandable since those cars created lots of downforce without the modern suspension-systems that could compensate the additional weight while preserving suspension travel for agility. Scott Mansell, who was driving 25 F1-cars built between 1982-2009 was saying, even the cars of the 90's are far more difficult to drive because they are very stiff. A stiff car always means too much under- and oversteer depending on the situation.

    Almost all real pro-racers started their career with karting and progress with an open diff formula-car series like Formula Ford/BMW (F Trainer) or touring-cars. Sim-Racers start their 'career' with GT3-cars that have highend-dampers (about 10k €), super grippy tyres always new, no cold or wet weather, top-level TC and ABS systems etc. and think, all other cars should drive similar to that. If you learn the basics with karts or the Midget Camaro, the F Vee and Trainer, there is no car in AMS2 that is causing any trouble from the handling once you get warm with it. They all behave between karting and F Trainer range.
     
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  14. GearNazi

    GearNazi Active Member

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    I'm sure it won't be Long now...
    [​IMG]
     
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  15. CrimsonEminence

    CrimsonEminence German localization/Testing Reiza Backer

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    Yeah, let's hope, the project is not beached for too long...
     
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  16. oez

    oez Mayor of Long Beach

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    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Apex

    Apex Active Member

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    Roger!

    It was the one thing I was hoping for.. err.. I dunno what to say really.. Oh well, Rome wasn't built.. and all that..

    :(
     
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  18. alink

    alink Well-Known Member

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    REIZA, now we need this (both things):
    The car and, especially, the track!!
    :hurrayreiza:
    79bde028f67ed10c54e37a23d82f7cc0.jpg
     
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  19. BrunoB

    BrunoB Un-Known Member

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    After testing this "sucker car" out a bit more in TT mode Ill have to take some of my "animosity" against all Reizas retro formula cars back.
    This car is pretty weird - but not so bad as its other retro cousins.:rolleyes:
    And not so bad as my 1st impression :D
    But beside of some hovercraft-ish behaviour both with/without front wheels(pic) I dont consider its extremely drifting behaviour as realistic (pic).
    Hehe and if some of you want to get good LB positions for almost free then grab this car while its time(pic):whistle:

    ByTheWay: I also have to admit that its not so often I have driven this car in real life - soo...

    hovercraft.png Slidey.png tt list.png
     
  20. Dicra

    Dicra Active Member

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    Man ... you're the second guy that, as soon as I say anything negative about the physics, comes to me with that "learn to drive and it'll be fine" nonsense.

    This is NOT about me being able to drive anything. The BT46 is not difficult to drive on low speeds at all (the difficulty is in the instability at medium-high speeds, which is not what I've commented on). My problem is that I feel that the physics on low speeds seem to simulate too much understeer (especially compared to old onboards).

    Just because you (or me) are able to drive any car, that doesn't mean it's realistic, enjoyable, or anything else - it just means that we can drive that car.
     
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