Automobilista 2 V1.3.1.1 & Racin´ USA Pt2 RELEASED - Now updated to V1.3.2.0

You are right.
A proof of this is to compare the different setups in LBs.
Because beside all the copy cats who probably dont know how to set a virtual car up then all the genuine self created setups are mostly completely different.

ByTheWay: If I take myself as example then Im unable to drive any of the default setups.
The reason why is because I have to drive without pedals (leg injuries) and therefore have to control most braking with gear down shifting. And no default setups created for "normal" people is able to support this extremely different driving style.

 

100% agreed. What makes a setup quicker or slower has relatively little to do with the setup itself, but more with the "confidence" it gives the driver (exception being the gear ratios maybe, but those are locked on many cars anyway). Every setup is a mix of different compromises. Do you want more rotation? Fine, but now the car is also less stable on throttle and brakes. Want a more stable car when accelerating? fine, but it will cost you apex speed. Determining what is best is up to you and your preferences.
Different driving styles require different behavior from the car. It is not the case that there is one driving style that is objectively the best or the quickest. So why force someone to drive a car that doesn't match theirs. Especially when it comes to things such as brake pressure, TC/ABS setting, and steering ratio.

For me, the worst example of why this doesn't work was an MP race with f309 cars on long beach. It was like driving on ice. The default was just not able to handle the bump, which definitely did not make that race more enjoyable for me.

 

So would you consider me a "lower-ranking" driver? Because I just want to get in and drive a car after a long day. Out of the 175 races I've done since the ranking system started, I've won 119. That's a 68% win percentage. I understand you may not like the default setups, but generalizing people who like them is a bad move. I may not be Ramsaysg or Nemesis, but I've done pretty well for someone with barely any setup knowledge.

Yes, understanding how to set up a car is more reflective of real motorsport, but so would pay-to-win cars, extreme punishments for crashes, and yellow flags that actually get you penalized for ignoring them. In real life, you bet I'd be working for months on developing setups and hiding that setup from competitors. The same would go for simracing leagues with actual prizes, but I don't always want to worry about the engineering side. If you like developing setups, that's all fine by me, but the start of this whole argument on fixed setups/open setups was someone saying fixed setup lobbies should be abolished. We're not advocating for completely banning custom setups at all, just arguing that fixed setup lobbies are occasionally fun. The series I had the most fun with in iRacing were fixed setup ones. As soon as I stepped into the open setup series, the field spread out and became less enjoyable, imho.

You may enjoy the challenge of developing a top-tier setup, but I enjoy extracting the maximum out the car I'm given. If you absolutely despise fixed setups, you're welcome to decline to join fixed lobbies, just as I'm welcome to leave a lobby if I don't have the magic setup someone else is running. Custom setups definitely have their place, and if it's a proper, ranked league with actual consequences, it 100% should be open setup. With that said, I used to have the top TT setups for Long Beach and I often refused to use them in open lobbies because it was unfair to other drivers. If I'm 1 second per lap faster than others, I would like to know it was my skill as a driver, not my hours in TT figuring out the perfect tire pressure or ride height.

 

Holy **** you guys take this **** really seriously huh?

 

I'm just fed up with elitist attitudes. Simracing is supposed to be fun, and people should be able to enjoy it how they like. I just get annoyed when people throw out generalizations "if you don't understand how to engineer a car, you're not good enough." I have plenty of fun even in open lobbies while I'm running the default setup. I've had fun in league events and spent hours on setups. The main thing is just to have fun.

 

Noooo. i thinks that a lots of folks is "reality" selective.
When reality does not serve the purpose of winning others it is not so important. Radar Anyone..?

 

No worries bro, Im on your side!

 

I think people forget that no matter how true-to-life these sims are, they're still fundamentally games at the end of the day, designed to entertain as well as simulate
If someone's entertained by throwing a default setup GT3 at Monza all day, that's just as valid of an experience as someone who does a full open setup F-Vintage season or whatever

 

Agreed, still 2 different setups will not be perfect for everyone, but at least it's better than just one available, it's more possible that you will more or less like at least one of the two. I would be ok if there are even three different default setups available

Even if still not perfect, a couple different setups would make sure nobody is using a physics setup exploit with stupid values (that we all know exist in all sims, right?), would make the race more fair to those that do not have the time to do setups and at the same time leave some room for choice to people who do not like the one default setup.

And by the way ( ), I also have a very serious leg injury, which forces me to use a very very light spring on my brake pedal (and cannot use the clutch pedal at all), so in many cars the default brake pressure is causing me great trouble, because it's very difficult to not lock up all the time. But still, I prefer having to deal with this problem and have a level playing field with default setups, than the other way around. I just really wish there will be some option in the future to adjust brake pressure in default setups, or at least be able to under-calibrate the brake pedal...

 

Maybe then certain options like steering ratio, brake pressure, fuel load, abs/tc value, brake balance, etc. should be able to be adjusted even in fixed setup lobbies. Tire compound is already adjustable in fixed setup races, so a few other options could be available just for "quality of life" fixes. Pcars2 had two default setups, a loose and a stable setup and even more for some of the oval cars. Maybe something like this or generalized high, medium, and low DF setups that way there's something that fits any track, but nobody has a massive advantage from setup alone.

 

This discussion leads nowhere anyway.
The majority of the online lobbies are always going to be fixed setup + GT3 + famous European track.
It is always going to be much much harder to fill up a server with open setup + F-Trainer/F-Vee + not-Euro track.

Kinda disappointing for me, but it is what it is.

Regarding skills, I know almost nothing about setups and I'm not a great driver either, yet I enjoy more when I can fiddle around with basic settings. So preffering open setups is definitely not any indicative of skill.

 

If custom setups are such a massive advantage then why are a high proportion of the WR's set with default setups?

For example (as i type) the WR for the Retro Mclaren gen1 at Virginia (full layout) is with a default setup and it is like driving on a knife edge, absolutely horrible. With a custom setup the time is approx the same that i can achieve but is miles ahead in stability and driveability. The generalisation that custom setups are always faster than defaults is not always correct or accurate. To be honest it's that some of the defaults are too nervous in either braking,mid corner or exit is the reason for using my own setups. Driving a twitchy/snappy car is not fun, and fun is why i play AMS2 driving the huge variety of cars on the edge round the great selection of tracks in different weather conditions.

Also i think people think every person advocating open setup spends hours doing them. Speaking for myself, I only even spend half an hour or so doing a setup and i use that for nearly every track.

No one that I recall asked for default setups to be banned. The reasoning was questioned and the flaws pointed out for using them.

 

lap records are very different than racing.

 

I get what your trying to say however in a spec car of which cars are identical defaults are perfect for championships many games even have servers with setups fixed when everyone’s using the same car

also I’m not sure how your defining defaults on TT are just as fast as setups I will correct you on that front and I’m not entirely sure how you worked that out other than you can’t drive defaults as good as you can with a setup which is fine.
For me it’s a I can’t be bothered and I ain’t got time so I use default… plus it’s way more satisfying to be top using defaults it’s a power trip

for me with a setup I’m anywhere from 0.6-2secs a lap quicker

 

I don't disagree with custom setups being there to fix issues in the default, and I'm not advocating for getting rid of open setups. What I was mad about was the insinuation that people who "just want to drive" are lesser drivers for not obsessing over setup.

The big TT reset, given enough time all of the top times will be custom setups again. Was like this for most of the popular tracks and will be again at some point.

Implying that good custom setups don't give you any noticeable advantage over the default is just straight-up false. I've used your setups before and gained a second or more per lap. My Long Beach TT setups gave at least 0.5-1.0 in race trim. So saying it has no massive benefit is just bogus. A whole hidden industry in setup shops exists for iRacing because of this kind of thing. Yes, it may not always give that much of a benefit, but neither does fixed setup lobbies to those who run them.

This I agree with, the F309 in particular needs work along with some of the Formula Classic Gen 2's. It can be extremely frustrating when a car just handles badly and you have to work around horrible handling characteristics.

With that said, some cars are just difficult regardless of setup. Formula Trainer, Porsche RSR, etc. and I feel a lot of people blame the setup for inherent characteristics of a car's handling. So many people complained about the RSR, but plenty of people were able to adapt to it. Same with the Formula Trainer, it may be a frustrating, absurdly difficult car to get right, but part of that is just the nature of the design. I understand the merits of building the setup to fit your own driving style, but there is also merit to just adapting to the car you have.

Read the next quote, he was joking, I was joking, then people got up in arms about the whole thing.

"Gentlemen, a short view back to the past..."

True, but they can be a good indicator of potential pace in race trim. Add about a 1-1.5 and you can have a good indication of what a TT setup can do adapted for race use. Tire wear and radiator aside.

 

I’m pleased thats cleared up anyone for a default lobby/identical cars?

 

maybe when the defaults are fixed and the non-aliens can have cars that are more driveable xd

 

Now into a more relevant subject: I find the current MP experience in AMS2 awful - mostly a waste of time, unfortunately.

I've very limited time through the day to race (one or two intervals of 1h each), and I'm spending my whole free time trying to do a single race online.

Most of the time there is just not enough people and the lobby doesn't fill up, often times when a lobby is well populated (guess which class? yea) something happens (lobby gets stuck / syncing issues through the grid / mass crash into mass exodus / etc) and I basically do not get to race at all. I see 3,4, 5 GT3 lobbies scattered with 2 or 3 people each, lobbies with 1 guy racing alone, lobbies with AI (which is absolutely trashy online), lobbies with 1000h practice sessions (supposedly for some league members to practice around).

Whatever it is, I spent 90% of the time looking for races rather than racing. Tonight I spent about 2h during the whole day trying to find a race, yet I couldn't.

Now I understand why some people stick to iRacing, even though graphics, physics and FFB are far inferior: you get to race with a nice grid through the day.

AMS2 is missing this experience. Last hope is that someday soon we will get either official scheduled races or a well integrated third party system such as SRS that actually has people racing in.

 

Lol this was already the topic before the whole fixed setup topic