Automobilista 2 V1.3.3.0 RELEASED - Now updated to V1.3.3.1

Most winged open-wheelers are a pleasure to drive, a few don't quite have the perfect default setup for me, but that doesn't really matter since I can adjust them.
There's probably room for small improvements here and there, but what we have is good.
I have mainly done TT and maybe problems come up in long races, but there are no long openwheel races in AMS2 (mainly short GT races) so this possible defect will probably never be a problem

 

@SaxOhare
Good explanation.
This could be (one of) the reasons Im so satisfied with my favorite newer formula cars.
Hehe but I have also to say that its pretty long time ago I have tested some of the older/ancient formula cars in the AMS2 portofolio.
Last time I became so frustrated of the weird behaviour that I said "Never again".

 

No realistic depiction of an aero-dependent open-wheel car will ever feel good on every track using the default setup. If all you do is judge cars on default setups, it will be totally random as to what you will like and dislike. Both AMS2 and R3E default setups tend to have the aero balance too far backwards, making them seem too stable and understeery. In contrast, something like the RSS F1 mods on AC seem to have the aero balance far forward by default, making them very sketchy to drive (something people confuse with "realism"). The RSS Formula 1979 is a good example, if you fix the mental default setup it's probably easier to drive than the Lotus 79 in AMS2.

If the car feels too planted (impossible to spin etc.), reduce the rear wing. If the car understeers on corner entry, increase the front wing. Once the right balance for the track has been found, adjust the overall level of downforce by small increments to find the best trade-off between straight-line speed and cornering speed.

 

Thank you for your thoughtfull description of why not to use default setups (to evaluate cars).
But I have used a lot of posts explaining why I cannot use default setups in ANY car.
And therefore wont repeat it here.

And your rather simplistic description of balancing a car I have no use of.
Just like @Jugulador I know a few more advanced things to set a virtual car up.
But thank you anyway.

 

I'm driving mostly openwheel this month, and back to tintop is booring af.
To tell the whole truth I do not perceive, at least with this setup, all the micro differences between one fix and another in a short time.
I have to reassign muscle memory, braking times, acceleration, etc.
I believe the secret is to give yourself time and wait for your body to adapt, like a pair of shoes. reviews after a few hours of release are premature.
you can't always drive in the same way on all categories with the various physics changes.
It is unrealistic to think that a driver always has the perfect car in all circumstances.
Personally, I adapt and in the first instance I try to improve my response, then I blame the steering wheel and pedals then the physics of Ams2, then the arthritis, then the children who make noise, the neighbor's dogs ... Then...
"This little noise bothers me so much" that I uninstall the sim and bury the disk in the garden and i plant a Baubao on top, maybe it's exaggerated.
How you can go from the goat to crying in the shower between 0.3 and 0.31.
Imho overthinking is killing the fun, say the man with 4 hands..

 

This might be quite far-fetched, but driving A LOT the 125cc 2 stroke kart in AMS2 has made me drive a lot better the old F1 cars, to the point I feel comfortable enough with most, if not all of them.

 

I think you are right about that.
But maybe I see it more like a compromise.
Between the adapting thing (muscle/mind) but also using the possibility to make the car easier to adapt to.
That is as I understand it the advantage of a good (or spezial ) custom setup.

Hehe but upon that there is alse a special brew of drivers who are able to adapt to the default setups.
But for different reasons its not everybody that is able to do that.

 

Oh man, that sounds like a very defence mindset.

 

No need to start psychoanalysing people.

 

This is something i have been wondering about for a while. It seems impossible to get the tyres to really 'light up'. It is glaring in a car like the FV12, which could easily light up the rears, even when up the gears a bit, in AMS1, and felt very realistic in this regard. Compared to the FV12 of AMS2 which will spin its wheels but wont light them up and will just accelerate its way out of wheel spin very quickly.

It seems to me that longitudinal grip provided by i spinning tyre is too high. It is most noticeable when launching a car, or even more so, trying a burnout. A standing burnout should be easily done in most cars with sufficient power, unless there is a larger difference between front and rear tyre width, which i suppose may lead to the rear tyres grip when spinning being able to overpower the narrower front tyres grip.
This seems to be what happens in all cars in AMS2. The spinning grip at the rear overpowers the front tyres.
Obviously doing burnouts is not an important part of driving or racing but i do feel it is a good indication of the tyre grip balance between different tyre states.

It is also very noticeable when launching a car. Any high powered car can be launched with full throttle and an aggressive clutch dump without any issue. This should lead to a comparatively terrible launch as the wheels spin up to max rotation rate available in 1st gear and you ping off the rev limiter while slowly accelarating, with the spinning stopping when you reach a speed which matches the wheel speed.
However, in Ams2, the revs will bog down as the power/torque struggle to overcome the grip, and the car will accelerate up to speed very quickly with no hint of rev limit until the car reaches its max speed in 1st. This normally happens in far too short a distance with wheel spin lasting only a cars length or 2.

The SuperV8 should easily spin its wheels, but last time i drove it, post 1.3, a full power launch was struggling to create any wheel spin at all. It does however lose traction very easily while powering through or out of a corner, probably too easily imo, which is why i think the problem is longitudinal grip based rather than lateral. And also possibly to do with a already spinning tyre rater than the point of grip loss itself.

I feel it affects the cars throughout the lap also. The extra forward momentum of a spinning wheel, i feel is responsible for the strange slides and drifts the can happen.
It allows wheels spinning out of corners to be easier than it should be. Not in terms of FFB and catching a slide but in terms of throttle application and avoiding or controlling a slide. A fast corner exit should be achievable with a bit of wheels spin but not with a lot of wheel spin. For example, using arbitrary numbers, say 50% throttle is right at the traction limit of the tyre on a given corner exit , 10% or 20% more throttle would lead to a manegable amount of wheel spin and possibly a fast exit but 100% throttle should lead to a lot more wheel spin and a much less manageable and much slower exit.
In AMS2 aggressive throttle on corner exit is usually no problem as any wheel spin drives the car forward with low ground v wheel speed difference rather the lighting up the wheels.

 

What an incredibly insightful post, putting the phenomenon into words far better than I could've managed. Especially the point about spinning tyres generating too much forward momentum. This is exactly the way it feels, and compared to what you see in real life, it doesn't seem to be accurate. Very well described!

 

This. Do this and a lot of times it fixes it.

I still have a bunch of tracks to fix up, and they will be done in due time.

 

Does it mean this bug can eventually be fixed by whatever it is you do?

Honestly I did not know of this workaround. I switched to a trackside camera, it didn't work and I gave up.

 

just sayin'...

 

Ohh riiight... an owner of a company checking in on customer feedback for one of the biggest projects of his life (AMS2) even though he is on vacation. This is TOTALLY unusual. This absolutely must support you theory of XYZ. I mean what else could it possibly be, if not the ultimate proof of whatever the hell you fantasized!? You are trying to make smth out of nothing and its pathetic.

 

All of yall need to start talking about cheese again... this is getting too heated

 

Personally I don't really understand why people on forums get so aggressive, like in real life or even on a chatspace like Discord I get it since you're in the heat of the moment mid-argument but on a forum you have a lot more time to think something you're typing out through and wonder "Would people take this the right way? Could I word this more respectfully?"
What do I know though

 

Because attention. Aggressive posts have far more chance of gaining traction. The more obnoxious you are, the more likely it is to actually get an answer or at least some reaction by developers (or anyone you want to contact, actually).

 

You do make a point, I guess...maybe that's why other places feel like near-constant warzones, particularly certain mod uploading platforms

 

Really well put together post Conor. I hope it gets picked up and analysed by the movers and shakers. Its been noticeable for a long time how much potential for improvement the issue has, especially during starts.