Automobilista 2 V1.5 Physics Development Update

Forwarded to, Renato as he has not so much time to read the org.post.

 

But how long without destroying the tires prematurely ?

 

Targa florio when

 

Why shouldn't you? I mean, disregarding the too forgiving argument, since well, people will never agree on that... and I do agree sliding is a bit much on some cars, even Renato did... sim racers are probably more used to hopping in different cars constantly than their real-life counter parts, since we do it all the time and can do it in seconds. How fast they can drive it ultimately is another thing altogether, but it's a virtual car, not black magic, nobody has to re-learn things from scratch. They've done it many times before.

Added "advantage" is you have no worries about killing the car or yourself, so this expedites the process greatly. In a sim if you desire so you can just be like: "Ok here I go bois! FULL SEND!" and then do some scenic routes through the gravel, or just go into a wall at T1. Restart, and most likely you will now end up in the second wall/gravel trap, but soon you will do a lap at a relatively decent pace, since there are no repercussions in the virtual world in general, well iRacing tries I guess

Besides the possible detrimental effect to one's health in real life, I doubt teams would appreciate the full send approach and costs associated with it, so a more careful approach is usually the result. Devs could combat this by making the cars actually harder to drive than in real life, but that would open a whole new can of worms. Probably end up with something like: "Cars were sliding too much before but now they are a death trap and too unforgiving!" rinse, repeat.

You're making this all very romantic and... dramatic. A game somehow invalidates the skill these drivers display(ed) in real life and now it's all void because AMS 2 does not behave the way you think it should? Because logic dictates most are pretty good at what they do (that's how they ended up being racing drivers) I find it hard to see how a game would or could invalidate that.

 

I know that 1.5 is still a w.i.p. regarding some of the cars, and several cars will still be tweaked and tuned for 1.6. Is Formula V12 one of the cars you guys are considering tweaking?

I tried to race it on a few tracks, and while the front end feels great, the back end does not. There is sooo, so much wheel spin on that car with the default setup, and one of the rear wheels gets very hot, in a matter of a couple of laps. Something seems off with that car.

 

I see many people complaining about this one, but for the life of me I can't feel the issue you are describing, I had a lovely time driving it on Imola with the default setup.

I had no trouble trail braking into Variante Villeneuve or into Minerali, maybe I am not pushing enough. Will try it again later today to see how my laptimes do. What's your fastest time if you have done the modern Imola in the F-Reiza?

 

The urgent point is not loosing grip but the area of REGAINING IT.
Exactly this area has become way to smoothed out/damped in 1.5.
Drivers more skilled than casual drivers are able to stay inside this area and get a kick out of it - both in sim racing and RL.
A lot of skilled RL drivers are even saying that staying inside this area is the essence of racing for them.

ByTheWay: Some sims are only "good" at the loosing part. Where its good-bye if you overstep it

 

I think to move things forward, you should stop frantically hiding your ghosts, so people can use your "speziale" setups, so more can experience the feeling of being skilled and move on from being casual drivers

 

Well that isn't necessarily my point, I'm not saying that doing that is faster over driving smothly, my issue is that I can do that without really paying any attention to the throttle input, just mashing throttle and doing little corrections to the steering wheel. It should be possible to control a slide but It shouldn't be that easy IMO.

Being rewarded for driving like a hooligan for 1 lap is nothing new, this is how rFactor 2 has been operating for years and I personally don't mind, because like you said if you do this over the course of a race you'll eventually be slower because you'll burn through your tyres, but there's also a matter of how difficult it should be. That will always be a matter of personal opinion.

 

I mentioned this already in the paddock club, try the McLaren MP4/4 and then try the Lotus 98T. The McLaren is one of the cars that seems to have gotten nerved with 1.5, even with 90% boost you can just plant your foot down out of corners and sail away no problem. The 98T however will still kill you at the spot for doing the same (as it should be). There's a couple of years apart between these cars and I reckon that the 98T was a bit wilder and less grippy IRL but this is night and day and both are 80's turbo F1's.

Some cars feel good and 'realistic' on my end, whilst others feel neutered almost like they have some sort of invisible stability control enabled. Either it's a bug or an issue with the tyres on these cars specifically but for sure it's not a general issue and it depends from car to car.

 

Exactly. All the Macs MP4/4-5-6 are calm. The 98T as you mention with wot and the turbo kicks in will turn you around, a short shift is still needed currently

 

I tried the MP4/6 and that felt normal though.

 

MP4/4 was after a crackdown on maximum turbo boost, it ran with a lot less power than the Lotus, especially in qualifying trim. So you get a better chassis and aero with a whole lot less power.

I do agree the MP 4/4feels rather tame but yeah, never drove either irl

 

Most of my tests, comparisons is at Long Beach or Road America or both. The mp4/6 seemed the same, but I’ve been wrong a few times (hundreds) haha

 

I mean, the Lotus has about 1300hp and the McLaren MP4/4 only 675hp, almost half the max torque as well. Doesn't seem too surprising.

 

You are correct. The Lotus 98T had a qual Eng that was rated at 1200hp, race was about 800hp. The point for me, the Mclarens were more fierce prior to the 1.5 and the 98T didn’t/Doesn’t seem any different

 

Also, Turbo engines in 88 had much more restrictive rules too (if I’m not mistaken 1,5bar max), and Turbo lag was much better (less prominent) on McLaren than on Lotus . And we cannot forget that MP4/4 was a masterpiece of engineering, regarded as one of the most balanced cars to drive on the limit.

 

Iracing is one that does that, no doubt. Don’t hustle the car or you’ll die

 

Without a final personal conclusion about the forum differences in assessment of how good or not so good the 1.5 update is - I have a bid of a possible reason.
Could maybe one of the reasons be that most (or at least a lot) of the drivers articulating themselves in this forum are driving their favorite cars reasonably fast.
But they are not driving the virtual car really close to its grip limits.
The reason I am wondering about this is that a huge part in this forum often does mention that
Im absolutely not one of the fastest drivers around. Or
Im at best a good midfield driver but consider myself reasonably consistent.

Because a car be it a RL one or a virtual one does behave quite different when it is being driven fast or when it is driven close to the mentioned limit of adhesion/grip.

ByTheWay: Actually this could be one of the main reasons of the differences in assessment of 1.5.
But as a general note this could also be the main reason why different people does assess different racing games completely different.

 

I don't necessarily think thats the case, to me the "issue" is not how it feels under the limit of grip but how does it feel over. I feel a lot of people here may think that the reception of the 1.5 update has been negative, but quite the contrary at least to me. The only reason I've been talking about the way the cars feel now is because of how much of an improvement I think this 1.5 update has been, the cars feel great for the most part, it's only that last tiny bit of tweaking that they need to end up feeling amazing.

I've been having a blast revisiting cars that I hadn't touched in years just because of how they feel now and I'm sure the future updates are gonna fix most of the complains that most people have! (You can't please everybody )