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Automobilista 2 V1.5 Physics Development Update

Discussion in 'Automobilista 2 - News & Announcements' started by Renato Simioni, Jul 25, 2023.

  1. BrunoB

    BrunoB TT mode tifosi

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    Thats OK.
    I did reread my post to check if it was slightly dull and/or easy to misunderstand.
    But I consider it reasonably clear
    - but because english is not my 1st.. and maybe not yours too(??)
    - then that could be the explanation.:)

    As I see this tire model problem then in an ideal TM the loosing grip area would look like this:
    a --------b--------c

    Reizas 1.5 tire model:
    a -------------b1---b2----b3-----b4-----b5-----------c

    a = car beginning to slide sideways
    b = obvious slide feeling and now some action have to be taken
    c = slide angle is too high and the car is lost

    ByTheWay: iRacings TM:
    a---------cb :D
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2023
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  2. YOUNG IL YOON

    YOUNG IL YOON crossfieldz_ROK AMS2 Club Member

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    That is hardest part when my ppl setup their wheel.
    Fanatec is standard and also great.
    and some lucky wheel bases are described in official FFB recommendation thread.
    but other wheel need to go long journey:confused: to find finest FFB setup.:cool:
    Show me the way reiza...:rolleyes:
     
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  3. kivipallur1

    kivipallur1 Member AMS2 Club Member

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    And after FX, damper and whole custom files there is also LFB slider. With my TS-PC Default+ needs some LFB, Default most certainly doesn't and for custom files it depends. So it seems it is quite easy not to tune FFB correctly.
     
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  4. kivipallur1

    kivipallur1 Member AMS2 Club Member

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    I would say that these official recommendations should be updated to 1.5 version as well, as they are meant for 1.4. For me things changed a lot with sliders after 1.5.
     
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  5. Scar666

    Scar666 Zum Glück bin ich verrückt

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    Untuned FFB would be no different to driving like this...
    [​IMG]

    You just aren't connected to the road... It's why so many claim car x was undriveable before 1.5...

    There's 4 sliders that effect tuning...

    It's no different to a guitar that is out of tune... And if you don't know how to tune it you will never know it's out of tune when playing it... And you will never hit the notes needed for the song...

    Unfortunately with AMS2 prior to this fix a lot of people had broken tuning pegs and couldn't find the sweet spot even with the ability and time spent tuning it...

    This update was basically like someone coming along and spinning each tuning peg on a guitar randomly... You have to find the new normal... Which is very different from the old normal because of the extra cues you get filling in the blanks that were there even for those with well tuned FFB...
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2023
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  6. Aza340

    Aza340 Active Member

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    Have to say I fundamentally agree with what you are saying.
    I use a Simplicity SW20 nm wheel base and previous to 1.5 I could only get a connected feel with custom files . Since the update I was initially disappointed, didn't honestly feel much difference and I wondered what all the fuss was about !
    I was nearly ready to give up on the game actually but decided to have one more session of ffb tuning. Started from scratch with the default ffb and eventually got it feeling fantastic , in game sliders aren't far off from where they were before but the biggest change was in my wheel base software sliders , needed way more damping and had to reduce the overall wheel speed by 40 rpm . Oscillation was a problem initially and no amount of in game damping would eliminate it ! Thankfully I have these options to mess with but I appreciate there are plenty of wheel bases out there that don't have that kind of software support and reckon that's part of the reason we have so many different reported experiences.
     
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  7. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Internal Tester AMS2 Club Member

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    You are correct that a lot of people don't have their FFB configuration optimized--either in-game or in their wheel control panels (especially for DD wheels that typically have a vast array of settings and sliders). However, I have not changed my FFB settings at all, yet can easily feel all the evolution and improvement steps, and have been providing commentary internally about it all along. The key is to set up your FFB properly and to your liking, because although some settings are clearly more realistic than others, there is also a margin for personal preference or whatever communication helps you drive better and faster. This means you may or may not need to change settings to enjoy the full benefits of v1.5.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2023
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  8. TomLehockySVK

    TomLehockySVK Well-Known Member

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    I for example use the T300RS GT and once i found the custom rFuktor 5.0.1.3, i am having an amazing time. Once i found the best possible settings about a year ago, i have not changed a single thing and i kept the same settings all the way for version 1.5 too, everything is till perfect and in fact better than it was before. For people who have a T300RS GT and wonder what settings i use, here they are. Keep in mind the "Damping" is a totally different thing with this FFB file compared to what the "Default" type does.
    AMS 2 rFUKTOR 5.0.1.3 FFB Change.jpg
     
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  9. BazzaLB

    BazzaLB Well-Known Member

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    According to your sig, you have same wheel base as me. Could you share your wheel base settings and in game settings? Atm I am using a custom FFB file, but am keen to see what other CSW v1 user might be running to compare.
     
  10. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Internal Tester AMS2 Club Member

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    I use 100% default settings on the wheel (always and in every sim/game), so never any fake drift or other distortion-causing settings.*
    In game, I use Default+ with Gain 58/LFB 5/FX 50/Damping 40.

    *Sidenote: the newer drivers and firmware seem to have eliminated all extraneous settings from my wheel, anyway. The only things left are FFB strength (100) and Sensitivity (aka rotation) set to Automatic.
     
  11. TinMan_JB

    TinMan_JB Member

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    Hello! In the past week I've finally been able to test 1.5 update. First I had a quick look at the usual suspects I drive after every major update - the M4 GT4, M6 GT3 (and other GT3s, Ginetta G40 Cup, and 911 Cup (I hear some say... boring! :) All felt better, especially the M4 GT4 which I considered a shopping trolley before 1.5 update. So far so good...
    After those I embarked on testing several low tier cars:
    - Caterham Academy - didn't like it much, car has a tendency to swing, and something in FFB put me off. I'd have to drive it some more to be able to give a proper feedback though.
    - Copa Classic B Gol - lovely example of FWD car, nice oversteer under braking, good FFB; AI is well calibrated in this class, at least in dry.
    - Old Stock Opala - it's fun to drift around, but something is amiss here. The rear tyres are breaking traction in any gear as soon as some steering is applied, even on straights. I know the car is on street tyres that are supposed to have forgiving slip properties and it has quite a torquey and powerful motor, but it feels as if the tyres are constantly in-between - never gripping fully. Car is able to slide for long distances and contolling it is easy (FFB is fine in that regard), but it is also quite possible to lose the rear if entering a corner too hot or abusing throttle on corner exit . Another problem for me was also the car's tendency to swing. First I thought something is wrong with my FFB settings and I lowered the LFB, but it didn't change much and as other cars are fine in that regard, I didn't explore it further. Increasing tyre pressures (from default) lowered swing tendency somewhat, but not much (5%?) - it felt as if driving with tyres half inflated, maybe the street tyre is not stiff enough? AI is mostly well balanced on Brazilian tracks I raced them on.
    - Lancer R & RS - just started a new championship in these, they are proper fun! FFB is nicely conveying US/OS, car has nice weight feeling, one can feel the car is AWD. AI is (for now) well calibrated; in Lancer RS setup screen one can't lower tyre pressures beyond 1.90bar. Also, to lower/raise pressures by 0,1 bar, one has to click several (4-5) times. In other cars I didn't notice this behaviour.
    These are some impressions I have for now, I hope they may be of any help.
     
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  12. Scar666

    Scar666 Zum Glück bin ich verrückt

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    Are you saying it's possible to create a sensation of grip through a FFB profile that allows you to drift well past the point of no return on a set of tyres?

    I'm just still trying to figure out why so many people think this current level of grip is amazing outside of "Drivers love more grip" or they just can't feel the grip...

    All of the nuances of AMS2 before are gone when it comes to grip... Dirt doesn't cause an issue on traction or braking, marbles are all about lateral grip loss until you crank the wheel and cause a spin...

    And worst of all the wonderful wet weather transitions are only good inbetween wet and intermediate tyres now...

    Standing water isn't a problem on slicks as long as there's a dry line the only issue is lateral grip loss... Just floor the throttle... The old "oh **** I can see a shiny patch ahead" only happens if it's during a turning phase...

    The iRacing cooling the tyres on grass works with the water... There's no aquaplaning from using the water to cool the tyres at Barcelona on the gen 1 V10s... It actively helps tyre wear as well... Both softs and hards can be driven through puddles with zero repercussions...
     
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  13. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Internal Tester AMS2 Club Member

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    Did you reply/quote me by mistake? I have no idea how your reply relates to my post to @BazzaLB?

    I also don't agree that all nuances have been lost. I have the same nuances that have always been there, plus some new pleasant ones that result from the v1.5 physics changes and @Coanda's hand-tuning every single vehicle to a common FFB standard. .
     
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  14. Scar666

    Scar666 Zum Glück bin ich verrückt

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    I don't know what to tell you... The difference between 1.48 and 1.5 in nuances is like having TC at minimum to switching to maximum... There's no need to care about the right foot through puddles on slick tyres... Inters were harder to control in the rain...

    It's definitely a slick tyre issue and not a driving aid issue as the car feels natural and realistic in the wet on wet tyres and on inters... Just not on slicks...

    As for why I quoted you...

    I'm wondering if this "fake drift" sensation is the actual grip level of the tyres that you are feeling... Because that falls in line with the rally style driving I am getting away with in cars not built for rallying...
     
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  15. reptilexcq

    reptilexcq Active Member

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    Depends on what wheel you have. I have dd1 and i set damping to 50 to get some resistant. FX is around 30 to get some feel of the wheel in straight line.
     
  16. Inkta

    Inkta Active Member AMS2 Club Member

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    One note, I feel it's important to add the tracks/cars combos that we are talking about, I'm guessing that could be useful to devs trying to improve said cars.
     
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  17. Scar666

    Scar666 Zum Glück bin ich verrückt

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    Whilst I certainly agree, and the most erroneous ones will get a bug report...

    I am yet to find a car that doesn't suffer from the issue with hot tyres in 1st and 2nd gear corners... Some cars have it worse than others, but I have yet to find a car that doesn't...

    Even cars that others say are too hard still have it when the tyres are warm like the BT52 and Caterham 620R...

    I am very open to suggestions to test and help nail down the issues... I'm going to focus on the other 2 Group C tyres but I would be happy to test something someone says is still hard...

    I'd absolutely love it if it was a global bug of some kind that only effects some people... Something similar to the Codemasters FPS bug where the higher it is the more grip you got... Because it doesn't seem tied to the driving aids anymore as more wet running is showing me... It's a slick tyre issue...
     
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  18. rmagid1010

    rmagid1010 Well-Known Member AMS2 Club Member

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    The old stock is realistically a sh*tbox in ams2

     
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  19. Scar666

    Scar666 Zum Glück bin ich verrückt

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    That's not a perfect representation of a slip curve but your point is valid...

    We've gone from being close to optimal in longitudinal grip and less than optimal lateral grip to similar lateral and a more forgiving longitudinal...
     
  20. TinMan_JB

    TinMan_JB Member

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    Yes, I seee what you mean... bolts flying around in the passenger footwell :)

    On a serious note, the video shows nicely how the car doesn't brake traction the moment driver touches the throttle. Yes, he is carefull out of corners, but then he smashes it to the floor without the rear stepping out violently every time. It does and he countersteers for a moment, and not as currently in game, where one has to countersteer for a long time to balance the car. That IMO is exagerrated.
     
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